The Son of Hamas & Gaza Hostage (Moran Stela Yanai) vs UCLA Activist (Full Cut)

Summary

Highlights

• Aiden Doyle, a third-year UCLA student, represents the pro-Palestinian camp, bringing youthful passion to the debate. 🎓🔥
• Mosab Hassan Yousef shares his experience of being raised within Hamas, yet finding a path to advocate for peace. ✨🕊️
• A visceral narrative from Moran Stela Yanai, who recounts her harrowing experience as a hostage held by Hamas. 😱🪁
• The dialogue captured the contrasting paradigms surrounding the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, with staunch differing opinions. 🤔🗣️
• A notable moment was the discussion on the right of a Jewish state and the opposition many Palestinians have to it. 📜🕍

Key Takeaways

• Debate featured Aiden Doyle, a pro-Palestinian activist from UCLA, and Mosab Hassan Yousef, a former Hamas affiliate turned peace advocate. 📚✌️
• Topics included the Palestinian identity, the viability of a Palestinian state, and perspectives on Zionism. 🌍🏳️‍🌈
• Discussion was intense, highlighting the difficult dynamics of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.🔥💬
• Personal stories from Moran Stela Yanai, a former Hamas hostage, brought emotional depth to the dialogue. 😢❤️
• The event underscored varying narratives on peace, violence, and identity in the Middle East. 🕊️⚔️

Overview

Chapters

• 00:00 - 03:30: Introduction and Welcome The chapter introduces the event taking place at the Regency Village Theater in Westwood, California. It mentions the date as June 16th, 2024, which is also Father's Day. The host thanks the attendees for joining them on this significant evening.
• 03:30 - 07:00: Introduction of Debaters The chapter begins with an acknowledgment of the contributions of David Levy and David Ruda. The speaker then introduces the debaters, starting with Aiden Doyle, a third-year jazz and philosophy major at UCLA who has been actively participating in debates.
• 07:00 - 10:30: Opening Statements The chapter titled 'Opening Statements' features a participant discussing the encampment and protests on the UCLA campus. They express gratitude to Mr. Doyle for his presence and contribution to the dialogue.
• 10:30 - 15:00: Question 1: Personal Life Influence on Activism Mr. Doyle was arrested last month by police for his activities on campus. During the debate, this incident is likely to be discussed. He engages in filming and documenting protests and discusses a variety of issues, including foreign policy and electoral politics, on his social media platforms.
• 15:00 - 20:00: Definition and Identity of a Palestinian The chapter details the birth and early life of an individual born in Ramallah in the West Bank in 1978. It highlights the significant influence of his father, Sheik Hassan YF, who was one of the founders of Hamas, a group responsible for an atrocity on October 7th. The individual, likely Mr. Yousef, is connected to Hamas throughout most of his youth and experiences intense horror during this period.
• 20:00 - 30:00: Discussion on Genocide and Violence The chapter discusses an individual's experience with imprisonment in Israeli prisons, where they faced torture. Despite the harsh conditions, this experience led to a significant shift in their worldview, particularly after witnessing Hamas prisoners torturing their own people.
• 30:00 - 50:00: Debate on Zionism and Settler Colonial State The chapter discusses the journey of an individual seeking political asylum in the United States, specifically in Los Angeles. This person has a unique perspective due to their background and involvement in a particular organization from a conflicted region. The individual is working towards creating a new path forward for future generations affected by ongoing cycles of violence. The chapter introduces Mr. Doyle and Mr. Yousef as significant figures in this context.
• 50:00 - 80:00: Conflict and Ethnic Cleansing The chapter titled 'Conflict and Ethnic Cleansing' introduces the topic through a structured discussion format. It begins with setting ground rules for the discussion, indicating a format where questions, often yes or no, will be posited to various individuals. Each respondent is given a two-minute window to provide their answers. Vita appears to be a facilitator or participant in this discussion, though specific roles or insights from her are not detailed within the provided text. The excerpt highlights the organizational approach to handling a sensitive topic such as ethnic cleansing, likely aiming for structured, moderated dialogue. However, specific content or viewpoints from the discussion are not included in the provided transcript.
• 80:00 - 115:00: Capture and Experience of Moran Stella Yanai To facilitate the structured debate, a shot clock is set to remind speakers of their time constraints. Each participant, starting with Mr. Doyle, is allowed two minutes to present their arguments on a given topic before the other person is granted an equal opportunity to speak for two minutes. Following the initial presentations, a two-minute rebuttal phase is initiated to allow the participants to address points made by their counterpart. The process then repeats for subsequent questions, allowing for a comprehensive discussion.
• 115:00 - 233:20: Q&A Session: Various Topics The chapter titled 'Q&A Session: Various Topics' features a transcript segment in which an individual discusses their journey towards becoming an activist for the pro-Palestinian cause. The speaker shares their long-standing aspiration to become a political commentator and suggests that their personal life experiences have played a significant role in shaping their activism on campus and globally.

The Son of Hamas & Gaza Hostage (Moran Stela Yanai) vs UCLA Activist (Full Cut) Transcription

• 00:00 - 00:30 ladies and gentlemen welcome to the iconic Regency Village Theater in beautiful Westwood California today is June 16th Sunday 2024 it's Father's Day and we want to thank all of you for being here and sharing this important evening with all of us tonight this evening would not be possible
• 00:30 - 01:00 without the great efforts of my good friends David Levy and David Ruda let's give it up for them I would like to um introduce our Debaters or uh conversationalist as the case may be Aiden Doyle who will be to my right here is a third-year jazz and philosophy major at UCLA and he has been an act participant
• 01:00 - 01:30 participant in the encampment and the protests happening on the UCLA campus I want to uh really give credit to Mr Doyle for being here we spoke to thank please absolutely thank you
• 01:30 - 02:00 Mr Doyle um was arrested last month by the police for various activities on campus and we'll probably talk about those during the debate he films and documents protests and discusses foreign policy electoral politics and a number of other issues on his social media channels mosab Hassan Yousef [Applause]
• 02:00 - 02:30 yeah he was born in ramala in the West Bank in 1978 his father is Sheik Hassan YF one of the founders of Hamas and they were obviously responsible for the horrible atrocity that happened on October 7th by any estimation Mr Yousef was linked to Hamas most of his young life he faced intense horror in his
• 02:30 - 03:00 youth he was imprisoned for 27 months in Israeli prisons he uh talks about in his book son of amas the the torture that he went through that he claims he went through and but despite all that his worldview shifted at one point and that's when when he saw that in these prisons Hamas prisoners were torturing their own people
• 03:00 - 03:30 so then he put He went on a six-year Journey um and sought political Asylum here in the United States in Los Angeles actually he came and he has obviously a very unique perspective being uh from that region and and part of that organization um so he's he's trying to make A New Path forward for Generations caught up in this cycle of violence so I would like to welcome Mr Doyle and Mr Yousef
• 03:30 - 04:00 [Applause] so we're going to the these are the ground rules we're going to uh have a question often a yes or no question uh and whoever I ask the question of will have two minutes to respond uh Vita is over here and she'll
• 04:00 - 04:30 have a shot a clock here um to remind you and um after your two minutes are done the the next uh person gets to speak for two minutes and then we'll have a rebuttal for two minutes and then we'll move on to the next question so I just I'd like to start off by asking what and and I'd like to ask you first Mr Doyle what aspect of your
• 04:30 - 05:00 personal life brought you to be an activist uh for the pro Palestinian encampment on campus and worldwide I'm assuming and um uh what what things in your life do you think brought you to this point sure well so yeah um for years I've wanted to be a um a political commentator and um part of being a political commentator is
• 05:00 - 05:30 understanding and researching uh domestic and foreign politics and uh in about August of last year before October 7th I just felt that it was imperative that I learned more about um conflicts around the world and I decided to research the Israel Palestine conflict by the time October 7th happened um I was already making videos and posting them on my YouTube channel about the conflict um and the more I researched the more I became um the more Pro
• 05:30 - 06:00 Palestine I became and the more I saw a need for um a Palestinian State Mr Yousef I'm going to ask you the same question what in I mean I I kind of led into this in the introduction but you tell us a little bit more about what led you specifically to become The Advocate you've been uh for uh peace and for um you know all the things you say
• 06:00 - 06:30 first of all good evening to [Music] everyone I never claimed that I'm an advocate I don't Advocate on behalf of any cause I think it's uh total idiotic to Advocate on behalf of anything I only represent myself and I only speak on my own
• 06:30 - 07:00 Authority and if I know I say I know and if I don't I'm not afraid to say I don't know so tonight here I'm only representing myself no one else not inside this room not outside of this room all right we had a debate up in Berkeley and I asked this question kind of like this question to start off with and I'm going
• 07:00 - 07:30 to ask it again here because I want to hear what you have to say Mr Doyle um what is a [Music] Palestinian well this is an important question we're talking about the Israeli Palestinian conflict so knowing what a Palestinian um is is vital um uh the PLO Charter and actually the Hamas Charter in 2017 defines a the Palestinian um as
• 07:30 - 08:00 anybody who lived in Palestine and their descendants before uh 1948 and who identified as Palestinian before then but since then since 1948 the um idea of what a Palestinian Palestinian has changed and in order to accurately answer the question we have to understand what a nation is and if Palestine uh is actually a nation um and uh a nation is made up of as we know of either an ethnic connection or a
• 08:00 - 08:30 cultural or connection to language to um to one people which is of course manifested in a word in this case Palestine um in the case of Israel it's Israel in the case of any other Nation it is whatever you use to define that Nation now whatever you think about the way that the Palestinian nationality came to be and what a Palestinian um and how the uh the Palestinians came to identify the themselves of Palestinians well as of right now it's irrelevant because the Palestinian national identity is one of the strongest and
• 08:30 - 09:00 most prevalent really across the world um a lot due to this uh this current ongoing conflict and so um a Palestinian is anybody who has Heritage in the land who identifies as Palestinians probably the the uh the simplest way of describing it um you know I I thought for many years that I was Palestinian before I drop that uh
• 09:00 - 09:30 identity and uh today I take it very seriously because um Palestine or Palestinian is an ideology political ideology that is affiliated with so much violence aggression violation of Human Rights and it does not represent
• 09:30 - 10:00 ethnicity it's not a nation it was never a country it's not a religion it's not a distinct language all I know that it was a colonial entity that lasted 25 years approximately 25 years since 19 uh uh 22 to 19
• 10:00 - 10:30 48 so a colonial entity Jewish people Jews Arabs Christians were called Palestinians prior to the establishment of state of Israel or the independence of the Jewish people and the partition plan so even the Israeli Prime Minister gold de mayor was
• 10:30 - 11:00 considered Palestinian with a Palestinian passport issued by the colonial Authority the British Mandate of Palestine at that time so if we are talking about ethnicity then it's the Arabs that makes a lot more sense they have the language they have distinct language they have religion they have a culture uh Jews are ethnic group Jewish people are ethnic group but
• 11:00 - 11:30 Palestinian this is an ideology time's up sorry thank you am I allow to respond to that yes you are so the categorization of Arabs as an ethnicity is not entirely correct because an ethnicity is not just based on genetics um but even if it was well Palestinians are not genetically identical to Lebanese they're not genetically identical to Saudi Arabians they're certainly not genetical genetically identical to um um Arabs in
• 11:30 - 12:00 Oman or Yemen there is actually distinct genetic differences between all these people but even if there wasn't it's important to understand that a nation upon its conception is not based on ethnic boundaries instead a nation is created whether it be through administra administrative lines the allegiance to the same leader whatever an ethnic Bas is then realized on top of that so whether Palestinians are identical to Saudi Arabians or jordanians it's not
• 12:00 - 12:30 really relevant what's relevant is that a Palestinian national identity of which nobody can deny uh has formed it started forming in the early 1900s and it has been uh prevalent ever since then and it is more powerful now maybe than it has ever been but then to say that because of Palestinian national identity formed only in the early 1900s and that people didn't call themselves Palestinian before then again is irrelevant because we don't call we don't say that Germans aren't German because people call themselves Prussian before 1871 like we don't say that um Israelis aren't
• 12:30 - 13:00 Israeli because uh ashkanazi Jews in the Middle Ages didn't call themselves Israeli it's kind of an irrelevant distinction especially considering that a national identity um especially in terms of the nation state only began as an ideology only began what 200 years ago so to say that because Palestinians didn't call themselves Palestinian in the 1500s it it doesn't have anything to do with the Palestinian nationality
• 13:00 - 13:30 I'm going to ask this of Mr Yousef if Hamas engages in actions that are considered violent or fatal such as shooting Rockets into Israel breaching the Gaza border with Israel on October 7th to Massacre Israeli civilians launching Rockets from areas of Gaza densely populated with Palestinian civilians such as the recent five rocket launch
• 13:30 - 14:00 from a humanitarian area in Gaza That was supposed to be off limits from the war if they do [Music] that and then call their own civilians victims of genocide when Israel responds with bombs and military action that kill Hamas militants
• 14:00 - 14:30 as well as Palestinian civilians surrounding them who are the Palestinian civilian civilians the genocide victims of Hamas strategy is to sacrifice civilians this is how they got the world's uh ay during the first second
• 14:30 - 15:00 third and fourth Gaza Wars and it paid off because it delimed Israel it made Hamas lots of money it gave them power and they became a recognized Authority uh on a regional level also on a global level as a legitimate resistance movement so um since then Hamas knew when they
• 15:00 - 15:30 built the tunnels beneath one of the most populated areas in the region you think they did not have an idea that civilians will pay the price they knew that and also who said that only Israel is killing uh uh civilians in Gaza in the confrontation in the shootouts in the booby traps Hamas is responsible number one for the atrocities of Gaza and I think this is the problem with the
• 15:30 - 16:00 uh anti-israel prop Palestine movement that they are in denial they don't want to condemn Hamas for actually operating from populated areas and putting the civilians in the ways of of harm what are we expecting from any army uh trying to remove bunch of savages uh from power and there is no other way but to send foot soldiers there is no other way but to confront while the the Savages hide behind their
• 16:00 - 16:30 own children in the morning they kill Jewish children for revenge and in the evening they killed their own children for propaganda and this is how they brought the world to its knees uh by harming civilians this is the weapon in Hamas hands could you repeat the question I will I'll just repeat the last part of the question
• 16:30 - 17:00 who are those Palestinian civilians that Mr Yousef was just speaking about and I described as being for example in the humanitarian area of Gaza where Rockets were launched from recently and uh who are those Palestinian civilians the genocide victims of when when we hear the word gen side used by many pro
• 17:00 - 17:30 Palestinian demonstrators in a scenario where Hamas uh militants are putting uh children on the rooftops of military command centers well then uh those specific deaths are the responsibility of Hamas but the deaths of the people in TAS Satan right the 40 innocent civilians who were killed by an IDF strike with no Hamas military Center anywhere near uh that's the the uh that is the responsibility of
• 17:30 - 18:00 Israel and Kareem Al Sharif back in uh uh back in the early couple months of the war where 106 civilians were killed again with no military Center anywhere near those deaths are the responsibility of Israel um and in any hospital that Israel bombs in any safe Zone and any evacuation route all of which Israel has bombed not not only a few times but repeatedly throughout the conflict um that is not only uh unjustifiable not not only legal under international law
• 18:00 - 18:30 because of well a lack of proportionality often times um the negligence of uh dropping leaflets which is actually the bare minimum according to international law but also because um it is asymmetrical civilian targeted Warfare which has been Israel strategy since 2006 um which constitutes the genocide but it's not only the killing of innocent civilians directly by uh with their 2,000lb bombs in Gaza and the targeting of Civilian centers whether Hamas is there or not um the genocide really precedes this or at least the
• 18:30 - 19:00 evidence of genocide precedes this um even in the past few years when Israel would deliberately Target Hamas Commander houses but they would deliberately Target Hamas Commander houses not when the only when not when only the Hamas Commander was at home but when the entire family was home and keep in mind Israel knew because of their artificial intelligence and their Advanced speciated Weaponry when the entire family would be home they decided to to destroy the house um when the Taro family is home when they had the option
• 19:00 - 19:30 not to um and so the deliberate targeting of innocent civilians by Israel is is evident but it is not just that it is also the starvation of the um of the god and people um and we can we dimes up but we can probably get into the evidence for the starvation and for the targeting of innocent civilians so just to be clear your position is that Israel is intentionally targeting civilians in Gaza yeah okay response nope nope nope nope we're not doing that we'll probably get to
• 19:30 - 20:00 that though we will and you're going to get to it too when you have your chance thank you go ahead Mr Yousef look I don't think Israel uh would Target civilians intentionally that's not possible first of all it would be totally idiotic why Israel would want uh to Target civilians to create so much enemies around the
• 20:00 - 20:30 globe uh I was part of the Israeli operation for about 10 years and many times there were civilians involved and we canceled the operation but the gravity of the situation in Gaza is completely different when we have Hamas high-profile uh dangerous terrorist who would hide in the tunnel for a long period of time then Israel would have a shot and now this Hamas top leaders
• 20:30 - 21:00 go hiding behind uh civilians does that make them immune this is a war and in war there are red lines that nobody should ever cross but is there a war without collateral damage without civilians dying in it especially when the terrorists deliberately hiding among civilians using hospitals schools as uh operation rooms I've been in those hospitals and in the schools right
• 21:00 - 21:30 beneath in the tunnels if I wasn't there myself I wouldn't even speak about it it's mindblowing how Hamas constructed their entire operation beneath the most vulnerable areas on a purpose because they wanted to drag Israel into such a dirty war to delegitimize Israel to show that Israel uh is killing civilians and what you are doing and the pro Palestine
• 21:30 - 22:00 doing here in the United States you are falling into Hamas trap there is no way Israel want to harm any civilian on a purpose but Israel do you think is not aware that civilians being harmed and it's a tragedy for Israel what's happening [Applause]
• 22:00 - 22:30 I can respond to that if you you you you you'll probably have a chance in the next question Sim go ahead well sure so uh the the proposition that massab has put forth is that Israel is not intentionally targeting civilians um unfortunately that goes against to the Israeli strategy in the
• 22:30 - 23:00 region now keep in mind that the whole idea behind Zionism behind a Jewish state is a Jewish majority so I actually don't think that genocide is a necessarily always going to be the conclusion of Zionism because most of the time it's going to be something along the lines of ethnic cleansing um but if Israel wants to actually uh fulfill their goals of um a Jewish state in the uh the land in the Holy Land then ethnic cleansing is necessary for that
• 23:00 - 23:30 goal um unfortunately for Israel and certainly unfortunately for the gazin is that creating a refugee crisis which was the intention of zionists like jabotinsky and theore Herzel and of course David benguan and many of the early Prime Ministers and certainly uh Benjamin nyaho right now um creating a refugee crisis is impossible because of the refusal of the Arab states around them to actually take in refugees the result is that the only way to perform ethnic cleansing is through uh deliberate murder of civilians which is what Israel is doing right now and the
• 23:30 - 24:00 evidence for that I well I've already outlined that uh they target buildings where there are no homas military centers but also they target buildings whether they're Hamas militants and there or not that uh the targeting of which is illegal and international law um it is the uh targeting of a of a a population Center regardless of whether there's a military Target without regard to proportionality and we we could probably get into proportionality at some point later in the discussion but again there is no um there is no excuse for the deliberate starvation of the population which is which is one of the
• 24:00 - 24:30 things that constit genocide nobody can defend and nobody can say it's because they don't want Hamas to uh to survive or to thrive because uh bread and water and uh cookies don't allow uh don't do anything for amas they only allow the Palestinian population to not starve to death I'm going to um since we're going off off schedule here it's you can respond to that a couple minutes so you say that you have
• 24:30 - 25:00 evidence how can you explain the 2 million Arabs who live in Israel and if there was ethnic cleansing where like where did they come from well AB I you you got your opportunity and do you think that the ethnic cleansing started on October 7 you know what was prior to that Israel allowed the gazans to come work into
• 25:00 - 25:30 Israel give them job opportunity in the tens of thousands and give them all the rights of any man power in the country and that includes the West Bank we have 2 million gazin and but also we have 3 and a half million West bankers and do think Israel uh needed October 7 to happen so they can start the process of ethnic cleansing through bombing the [ __ ] out
• 25:30 - 26:00 of people in Gaza if if if there was an ethnic cleansing would have taken place over 70 years and today you wouldn't find any Arab in the region the ethnic cleansing actually took place in the Arab countries show me how many Jewish people are in the West Bank or in Gaza show me how many Arabs are in any any Jewish in the Arab countries there are 400,000 Jewish people in the West Bank right now they're
• 26:00 - 26:30 settlers hold on hold on hold on hold on no there's there's 400,000 in the West Bank hold on hold on no no no no no no Aiden Aiden no don't No Interruption let him let him finish you you'll have your chance you're going to have plenty of CH no he's he's talking about the Samar Samaran Samaritans the settlers the settlers yes those are in um inim well those are under the protection and the authority of the Israeli uh defense forces okay they have their own Community they are on the top of a
• 26:30 - 27:00 mountain they don't go into the Palestinian territories I'm talking about any Jewish person in ramala in Kon in Janine if this if any Jewish person go into this areas they would be killed mercilessly and also I'm talking about the Arab countries I'm talking about where are the Jews in Jordan where are the synagogues the Jewish people left the synagogues erected when they evacuated Gaza you know what the gazin did to the synagogues they demolished
• 27:00 - 27:30 them first they burnt them they demolished them to erase every Jewish uh Trace in the region so when we talk about ethnic cleansing we need to be very careful because if your sto if your house of glass don't throw stones on other people's houses yeah so um you have to answer the question then um did the Was the removal of Jewish people from the from Gaza was that a result of the IDF removing them in 2005 or is that a result of uh Hamas
• 27:30 - 28:00 pushing them out it was a result of the IDF pushing them out in 2005 then you ask the question about what are there Jewish people in the West Bank well area area SE is a part of the West Bank um it is an occupied territory and uh there are 400,000 Jewish settlers there I don't know why anybody would dispute that that's just a fact um but then you talk about why are there still 2 million um Israeli Arabs living in uh Israel right now well it's important to understand what the goal of Zionism was
• 28:00 - 28:30 because the goal of Zionism has never been to eliminate every single Arab ever it's never been to even ethnically cleanse every single Arab from uh from Palestine the whole goal of of Zionism and having a Jewish state was to just have a Jewish majority State and if you actually understand the roots of Zionism you'll understand that it was totally acceptable for the early Zionist to have say 2 million Arabs living in Israel as long as there were many many many more Jewish people so Zionism is both
• 28:30 - 29:00 conducive to ethnic cleansing and to the reality of the situation which is of course ethnic cleansing which is that two million uh Arabs have been allowed to remain in Israel it's not about getting every last Arab uh out of Israel it's more about maintaining racial Supremacy over Arabs in order so that the the interests of the state of Israel and the Jewish people are maintained uh it it it Bears complete disregard to the people to the Arab people um in Israel and all the Palestinians all the Palestinians in Palestine um and
• 29:00 - 29:30 and but even then and I'm we only have 30 seconds so we can't get into all the evidence we'll probably get into it later but there's currently a covert ethnic cleansing campaign going on in Israel uh through discriminatory land policies through uh things like the uh the absentee property law in 1948 things like the admissions committee law which don't allow uh Palestinians Israeli Arabs in Israel to live in Jewish neighborhoods uh we'll probably get into the evidence of all that later there is ample evidence that um Israel is solely but surely discriminating against the uh
• 29:30 - 30:00 Israeli Arab population in Israel in order to either force them out or to call in order to uh stop the population growth okay we're going to talk I in order to uh give this a little more back and forth I'm going to ask a question that does deal with Zionism since you just brought that up um and it it was interesting to me that you
• 30:00 - 30:30 said I don't remember the exact word but it sounded like you said they there's lack of consideration of the Palestinians is that that accurate what you said well yeah I mean in Israel they're they're called Israeli Arabs but they you most of them identify as Palestinians Israel okay so how do you Mr Yousef Define this term that is used a lot which is settler colonial
• 30:30 - 31:00 state Israel as to Israel well I think if there is any uh colonizer there are the Palestinians those are the ones who are identifying with a colonial entity and those are the ones who want the ethnic cleansing of the Jewish people from the land um this is the IDE ology of the uh
• 31:00 - 31:30 real colonizers it's actually made up by uh colonial power this is where Palestine came from and this is what attracted the ASAT and what what has been attracting many um Fanatics um to identify as Palestinians but Israel in Israel I see all type of ethnic
• 31:30 - 32:00 groups they have equal rights in fact the Arabs in Israel have equal rights with less responsibility because they don't defend the country not all of them volunteer in the IDF and it's not mandatory for the Arabs to serve in the IDF and that's the riskiest job any ethnicity in Israel is doing so the allegations of um upper tide and ethnic cleansing I think they
• 32:00 - 32:30 are Bas baseless uh decent citizens uh have equal rights those who show loyalty to the country to the Constitution uh to the major interest of the country not the ones who are troublemakers who belong to uh foreign entities uh and they serve the interest of any um outside Authority so we can have stories
• 32:30 - 33:00 about people who violate uh the Israeli laws and therefore they are not treated like decent citizens basically they are criminals or terrorists well there's there's a lot to respond to there the first is the idea that for um for whatever reason the Palestinian uh farmers and Shepherds and um the
• 33:00 - 33:30 Palestinian farmers and Shepherds early on in the 1900s um are somehow settlers or that they're descended from settlers which is absurd because well if it was whatever Arab Arab dynasties in the um in the 600s that colonized Palestine and therefore the Palestinians are descended from Arabs that colonized land well it's absurd because that doesn't allow you to take away their human rights but it's also absurd because uh 80% of
• 33:30 - 34:00 Palestinian DNA is is actually letin so it makes no sense whatsoever to call them colonizers because in no sense of the word are they now um to talk about the um uh whether Israel is a settler colonial state well to colonize a land means and this is just a definition it means of a people to go to a land and colonize it um and excuse me to go to the land and to settle there um whether uh Jewish people have are IND to the land or not and whether Palestinians are indigenous to the land or not that does
• 34:00 - 34:30 not actually preclude them from being colonizers because they are of a people of the Jewish people who went to Palestine uh and settled there and you don't have to listen to me you can listen to the early zionists who use the same verbage of colonize uh settle uh colonialist um it's it's it's written there in uh in their own words so um I have a couple question questions I just want to ask you right now in response to what you just said there
• 34:30 - 35:00 wasn't it true that the word colonial or colonist was had a different sort of meaning back in the early 1900s than it's taken on in recent decades with this idea of sett settler colonialism uh which has been defined as I've read as um agents of a mother country or sponsor that is um that are coming to a foreign land uh to settle it and not just that that's
• 35:00 - 35:30 just the first part and the second part being and to remove the indigenous population so how does can you explain how you think Israel or uh or Zionism really uh or Israel is a settler colonial state with that definition uh sure so first of all I actually forgot to mention something in mad's previous statement which is that Israeli Arabs live with equal rights in Israel this is just patently untrue um and we can get
• 35:30 - 36:00 into why that's untrue in a second let's keep on let keep sure sure because I'm sure we'll get to why Israeli Arabs are being discriminated against systematically in Israel um but uh to Define Israel as a settler colonial state based on people who are foreign to the land uh coming to the land and removing the for the native population well none of us we all know what the nakba is which is Was the removal of 700,000 ethnically Palestinian people from the land of Palestine and forcing them out into either Lebanon or Jordan or the West Bank which became Jordan or
• 36:00 - 36:30 Gaza which became Egypt um so so that absolutely did happen and if you're talking about foreign to the land uh well oh I I didn't just say foreign foreign land I said mother country sponsor oh yeah so well uh if you look up the definition of uh to colonize which any of you can do right now it's of a people to go to a land and settle it it doesn't you don't actually need a mother country to colonize you only need a mother mother country to become a colony and nobody calls Israel a colony
• 36:30 - 37:00 so in that sense just definitionally uh it was a colonial it was and still is a colonialist entity but uh in terms of being foreign to the land um it it doesn't really matter how far back you can trace your ancestry to the land I'm not um I'm not indigenous to Africa even though all people came to Africa it's kind of a ridiculous statement have you been Have you ever been to Israel no no no but I'll say I'll say uh the No No
• 37:00 - 37:30 the the what is happening what is happening to Israel and Palestine doesn't care whether I've been there or not it's the reality whether you like it or not no you can no you can say you can say what you can say what you want you can say what you want the evidence speaks for itself the evidence speaks for itself because when you murder in civilians it doesn't care whether Eden d goes to UCLA or not it cares whether inocent civilians are murdered or not it doesn't care whether mad was born in Palestine it cares whether innocent civilians were murdered or not that's the reality it doesn't matter where I come from where massab comes
• 37:30 - 38:00 from please please please people people I have to ask you sorry Mr Yousef I I there's nobody's dying in this room by hearing some words so let's just take a breath and we'll and we'll let them speak half the people in Israel don't know the history of their own country it doesn't matter who cares Okay no Okay that please you have to understand understand you have to understand that the actual reality it
• 38:00 - 38:30 doesn't matter where you come from you can still understand what is happening it does because it doesn't care because it doesn't care it doesn't care who whether somebody dies or not if if I if I'm born in the United States it doesn't affect whether somebody dies in Palestine you don't understand that you don't understand that nothing matters what matters you're going to get to ask him whatever you want after we we will have Q&A guys after facts matter facts do matter facts matter facts don't change
• 38:30 - 39:00 if I was born in Palestine or born in the United States they don't change they don't change okay and what's what's the source of your what's the source of your information what's the source of your information does Benny is Benny Morris okay is that is that a good source give me a legitimate book and I would like to know an author that have the legitimacy that they have studied that they have studied and they have the authority to speak on the topic name name three books as source of your information yeah
• 39:00 - 39:30 sure the nation form by Rashida khi rashidi rashidi who who is that I never he of this woman he was actually one of the one of the uh he was part of the peace process in the 90s okay but you don't know about him that's fine I still respect your opinion it doesn't mean that you're wrong just because you don't know a single author okay that's fine I can go on Benny Morris uh the righteous victims 1948 um both of those books does that safy or do you want me to keep on going or does do the facts do the facts
• 39:30 - 40:00 change depending on how many books I've read I could also talk about uh create I think it's called creating a nation by um by Eddie and balabar or you can talk about Shalom wasand a Tel Aviv author who wrote the invention of the Jewish people an Israeli Tel Aviv author uh so if your point is that the what I'm saying is not right because I haven't read enough books well you're wrong on both counts uh okay first of all first of all all the books that you read looks like
• 40:00 - 40:30 going only in one direction to delegitimize Israel do you know who Benny Morris is I don't need to know I think you're just using making up stuff or making the making of the Israeli nation and I think making of the Israeli Nation do you know that book or do you are you just uneducated like what's the look what's the answer listen listen what did I tell you from the beginning of this conversation I don't need to read books to know my oh you don't need you don't need to read books but I do I don't need I write the books I write
• 40:30 - 41:00 them I live the experience I I am the author all the credibility you gained I am not a secondhand knowledge all all of the credibility that you gained by living in Palestine was taken away from you when Israel put them put you on their paycheck okay all right all right we're going to if you no because if have evidence that they have a paycheck from Israel you worked for Israel for six years it's it's in your biography what's your evidence so you weren't paid to work for Israel you just did it
• 41:00 - 41:30 willingly well uh exactly okay first of all first of all if you want to take personal aim I can take you on a rabbit hole that you will never get out of it go ahead I have been patient and respecting you you know why because you're just an arrogant student with no knowledge with no life experience advocating on a very dangerous cause being a useful idea in the hands of
• 41:30 - 42:00 terrorists creating trouble creating trouble putting encampment breaking the law advocating on behalf of a terrorist organization designated by the American law as a terrorist organization makes you a terrorist so if you want to talk about personal things you challenge me for for doing a legitimate work for a democracy to save human lives and you want to reduce my effort to say that I got paid
• 42:00 - 42:30 10 years fighting and chasing after terrorist who blow up killed Americans Israelis Arabs Muslims all type of people indiscriminately do you think you can sit here and judge me and tell me when you say fighting when you say when you say you're fighting for Israel would you say that you're advocating for them I told you I only represent myself so you're not fighting for Israel and you don't have the authority to sit there and judge tell me I took money or did not take money this is not your business no no you did take money that's a fact
• 42:30 - 43:00 and that's fine you you took money from you took money from Israel and that's okay you're a prop you're a prop you're a propagandist for Israel that's just a fact and it's the reality of the situation but again I don't know how many times I don't know I don't know how many times I have to say I don't know how many times I have to say I can speak from my own authority I can speak from the authority of historians I can speak from The Authority I can speak from the authority of the thousands of Palestinians who live in Palestine who are actually living there right now because at the end of the day the reality of the situation doesn't care about Aiden doy or massab Yousef whether
• 43:00 - 43:30 there's a genocide going on which there is it doesn't doesn't matter whether I was born in the United States or not it is simply the reality and you can check all my sources you can go read Define a genocide Define a genocide you speak of what is genoci oh sure the killing of a whole or a part of a population with intent well are you happy you not do you not think I'd this this is not what a genocide is is defition of a genocide I'm sorry you don't know what genoci but that is the reality let me ask you something with intent based on
• 43:30 - 44:00 what based on their ethnicity based on their religion based on their culture based on their national identity as Palestinians well Palestine is you can talk about intent I mean we can we can start naming names we can go to back to em alahu who wanted to Nuke Gaza we can go back to theor Herzel who wanted to remove all of the gazin from all the Palestinians from Palestine we could go back to uh the mowing the lawn initiative which is high frequency civilian targeted asymmetrical Warfare that targets civilian infrastructure it
• 44:00 - 44:30 doesn't matter it doesn't matter it doesn't matter where you go do you think it matter you go there is one moment do you think do you think you are smarter than the judge of the IC who just said that what happens Gaza is not a j you me the icj the icj yeah you think you're smarter than the judge absolutely not do you think you're smarter than the judge I'm not smarter than the judge and the judge said what's happening in Gaza is not a genocide no no no well actually actually that's not true what they said well for one the determination as whether genocide is going on actually hasn't been deliberated so you're just
• 44:30 - 45:00 spreading misinformation what they said was that the rights what they said was that the rights of the Palestinian people especially the rights of the people of Gaza are at risk of uh their rights to not be genocide at our risk of being infringed and they said that in order for Israel to comply with international law in all three resolutions that they have released they had to do a number of things they had to stop targeting civilian population centers they to stop starving the starving the population which includes uh arresting the people uh who were protest who were stopping the aid from getting into Gaza which
• 45:00 - 45:30 they haven't done and they also had to not invade Rafa none of those three things they have done um and so when massab says that Israel is uh that the icj has said that Israel is not committing genocide they made no such determination uh the actual determination will come out in probably two or three years you talked about Herzel as one of your people as Zionist and founding people of Israel as intentionally removing Arab Arabs from the area and there's a um I was reading about this because Mark Lamont Hill at
• 45:30 - 46:00 the berley debate brought up the same point and I looked it up and I read that Theodore Herzel uh had a famous letter to an Arab notable Yousef Z AL khalidi who and he wrote quote who would think of sending Palestinian Arabs away it is their well-being their individual wealth that we would increase in bringing our own so uh how do you Jive that with that he was an intentional you know uh ethnic
• 46:00 - 46:30 cleansing or genocide if you actually read other letters what he said was and look it wasn't actually as bad as what's happening to be fair to the ort so he was actually what's known as a he was a political Zionist he was fairly liberal for the time um he believed that um he said in other letters that we need to stop giving them jobs we need to make sure that they don't have a livelihood here and that we need to make sure that in other Arab countries that um that they do have a livelihood in order to uh convince them to leave so it was a sort of soft ethnic cleansing if that makes
• 46:30 - 47:00 you feel any better but then uh you also mentioned how Theodore Herzel said that we would bring civilization to the Palestinians well this is reminiscent of uh Christian missionaries who talked about Africans as if they were Savages as if they were uneducated if as if they needed Christianity and western civilization to be brought to them so that they could tame them is an extremely racist ideology that one one that was inherent to Zionism as they beli that they would be bringing civilization to the Palestinians that they would be improving their lives um and when in actuality they removed them
• 47:00 - 47:30 uh they killed them on mass and they uh put them in concentration camps what okay so how do you how do you just and I want to hear what you say but how do you reconcile that statement with the nakba um claim uh and it's not a claim it's a it's a word that is used as a catastrophe uh by the Palestinians when they left um the land of what is now Israel at the Declaration of
• 47:30 - 48:00 Independence of Israel and they were largely in camps in Jordan refugee camps in Jordan and I think Gaza and um now those are Villages um what do you make of the fact that Israel was attacked immediately upon the Declaration of its independence and that these it's pretty clear in the record that these Palestinian Arabs were told by these Arab countries surrounding them to leave lest they be harmed during the
• 48:00 - 48:30 attack um what do you make of that well yeah so the countries of Egypt the countries of Jordan the uh countries of Lebanon Iraq Syria the countries that attacked during 1948 they're not Palestine they're actually different countries um but then the the assertion that Palestinians left during the knba willingly well some left willingly some left willingly because they were being harassed and terrorized in the streets by the uron and the Ley and the haaga but uh but over 400 Villages were destroyed hundreds of thousands were forced out but it wasn't
• 48:30 - 49:00 just through force and through brutal terrorism uh that these groups inflicted upon Palestinians living in Palestine at the time it was also uh through legal means uh with the absentee law declaring any house that was uh that was empty um to be declared the state of israels and that they then moved Jewish Tennison um or through um the cancellation of the the Ottoman Empire uh the permits that were given during the otom Empire uh most of which were um
• 49:00 - 49:30 Palestinian homes when this happened the Palestinians were evicted and Jewish SS moved in so I mean sure some left will willingly but you have to ask was it willing or were they being terrorized and then they decided to leave now then also the claim that the Arab leaders told Palestinians to leave because they'd be able to return later well that's true but it just it accounts for um couple thousand um maybe tens or 10 20,000 as compared to like 700 where are you getting that fact from what were your numbers well no what
• 49:30 - 50:00 I'm asking you where were you getting that fact from just general knowledge what well I mean it's it's important if you have if you have a more accurate number I'm I'm not it's not this is not my uh I'm not debating here I'm just asking questions oh sure sure so well the number of 700,000 do you agree with that number I do agree with that the number of a couple thousand if not tens or 20 thousands me delber General don't you do agree that it's really really important when we're saying these things
• 50:00 - 50:30 let me finish let me finish um cuz we've been listening to you um and uh it's really really important when you make these statements which are affecting people's lives in the world that we are accurate in our facts and so I'm not criticizing you right now I'm just asking you what where your source is I'm really want to know uh no if you have a more accurate number you okay thank you I just it's okay how much is it how much is it because if it was it 700,000 that were told by the a PO mrf might be able to tell an academic in the audience or somebody who knows might be able to tell
• 50:30 - 51:00 but no because just well it's important to recognize that just because I don't remember a source from a research that I did eight or nine months ago doesn't mean that the the reality is isn't the the case so so but no no but if it was 10,000 well that's important that means that only 690,000 Palestinians were forced out of their homes doesn't make a big difference these are hypothetical situations but we really want to deal with facts when we're dealing with human lives so so yeah so let's Mr Yousef do you have a response to what he's been saying you'll ask him that afterwards
• 51:00 - 51:30 right yeah keep your questions remember your questions write them down look people who are in the territory they have ownership to their property nobody's coming to take their property from them my father is a Hamas leader Israel never came and said oh you Hamas give me your
• 51:30 - 52:00 house our neighbors our entire town people on their property they've been there for before I was born they still in their households nobody's forcing them out of their houses prior to the Palestinian intifada in 1987 we were able to move freely travel outside the country go to Tel Aviv go to the beach go everywhere we did not have even one
• 52:00 - 52:30 checkpoint things only changed when yaser arat pushed the indoctrination of Palestine on the kids shutting down the schools exactly what you are doing here on campus shutting down the school and building encampment to disturb the student life for the sake of palistine a foreign entity that you don't understand that you never been there that you think think that it ever existed that you think that there is occupation that you
• 52:30 - 53:00 think you know better than the judge and you say that there is a genocide that the verdict is going to come sometime in the future God knows when so you created this narrative in your head based on YouTube and Tik Tok videos then you claim that you educated yourself from legitimate resources but I tell you we as the people the Arabs who live in that land nobody ever took my house even though we
• 53:00 - 53:30 are Hamas and nobody has the right to take your property you have your name to it then it's yours and there are millions of people like this so all your claims all your claims are baseless and I invite you to visit the place to begin with so you can have a direct experience [Applause] I'm going to move on I can respond to
• 53:30 - 54:00 that um oh you can respond to everything you are [Laughter] Einstein such an arrogant generation you know I I I don't I don't think I don't think that helps I I think that I think it does it I I don't think
• 54:00 - 54:30 it does I think just an idiot he's he's not an idiot he's obviously a very intelligent guy which is so no no so so you can you can call me uh Tik Tok Watcher you can call me gen Z you can call me arrogant what you can't do is respond to the facts that's what you fact well you know what's facts to be fair that to be fair we need facts and that's what I was kind of asking you about so oh oh well I was born there and you weren't the fact that you have a
• 54:30 - 55:00 secondhand knowledge no no the fact that fact that you think saving human life is treason no no not the fact of where either of us were born I don't think the reality would change if I was born in Zimbabwe the reality would change the reality would change if I was born in a different country oh that's nonsense that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard no no no no what the the facts that you can't respond to are the deliberate targeting of hospitals that would that do not that do not that do excuse me that do not have that
• 55:00 - 55:30 do not have military po military centers in them like K Al Shar like T Satan like the evacuation roots that were bombed by Israel and this is not according to me this is according listen listen Mr let me let me just take control here for a second I you made your point you made your point um you I don't know if you had something to say just quickly in response to that cuz we got to we got to move on okay targetting hosp hospitals this is it's evident and I
• 55:30 - 56:00 told him that I have a firstand experience but it looks like no matter what I say he's going to say you are paid you on a payroll you're advocating on behalf of the zionists and he will continue to be in his denial for eternity this is a phenomena of useful idiots that they're advocating on behalf of a dangerous organization they're bringing chaos in TI to the United States of America because the government is not taking care of this business
• 56:00 - 56:30 naturally the Department of Homeland Security would persecute anyone who's given a material support to a terrorist organization this is the natural environment but now it looks like it grow so wild that people like him has the audacity to talk to someone who risked his life on a regular basis to save human lives this is what we did I lost my entire family the wealth of Hamas did you know that I managed Hamas
• 56:30 - 57:00 money do you know how much money is that you would sell your mother for that kind of money Hamas money was under my authority if I wanted the money I would have stayed there you tell me about a paycheck coming from Israel you're totally mistaken son at the beginning I respected you and I gave you the opportunity because we have to build a dialogue but it looks like you only have accusations and you contradicting yourself and when an
• 57:00 - 57:30 eyewitness come to you you don't have even facts and you're very disrespectful to some of the hostages in the audience you're very disrespectful I'm very sorry for calling you a Tik Tok user arrogant an idiot no that's what you called me I'm sorry that was actually that was actually that was actually the person that you I haven't said use any personal insults towards you um so all right let's let's let's just take a breath right now so I'd like to go a little bit off script here before we get into
• 57:30 - 58:00 question and answer and I would like to invite up her if she will um Moran Stella y i who was released by Hamas as a hostage in Gaza in November I believe it was Stella
• 58:00 - 58:30 Stella no Stella I actually I want you to sit here I'm going to go over there okay because I'd like you to sit with Mr Doyle and Mr [Music] Yousef and you can take my microphone for right now you can sit next to I'll you just made
• 58:30 - 59:00 me take a huge breath before there because I really want to talk to you from uh look at her from an eye level you know hear you no it's okay it's okay it was only for him was enough for you I guess I just would ask you the simple question of what do you want the world to know what do you want Mr Doyle to know about what happened to you and what maybe things that are not people are not aware of so first of all I want to ask you please do not clap your hands and do not react
• 59:00 - 59:30 to anything I'll say now I really ask that I don't know the vast majority here seems to be us against one agenda and I want it to be very very clear between us CU I really really want to talk to you in an eye level and I want to tell you a story if you want to hear it look at her I was kidnapped first of all I want you to know that I didn't watch the news for 11 years because I don't believe the news can bring you positivity in life really I
• 59:30 - 60:00 choose the context that I watch for 11 years I'm an artist I served the Army 22 years ago I served givati which is a unit that held the Gaza line 22 years ago during the warat Magen if you heard about that after a few years I chose to to be kind and better to myself that therefore I left the dream
• 60:00 - 60:30 that I had to become shabbach or a soldier again or this and that and chose to become an artist I have all the signs on me I had an Arabic necklace on me I had the Indian ganach tattoo on me I had Pharaoh on my f fingers cuz I'm half Egyptian and half Moroccan but I'm Jewish okay and I have the letter I got on my hand you you know why because I believe in coexisting did you know that the vast
• 60:30 - 61:00 majority of the hostages believes in coexisting so I'm an artist and on October 7th I went to fulfill my dream I went to make my dream come true I've worked on that dream many many years but I didn't went through with it I didn't believe that my dream will come out I want to tell you that my best friend she's Jewish and she's married to an Arab person she lives the front door on
• 61:00 - 61:30 my front door she's my neighbor I want you to know that my my suppliers my jewelry suppliers are Egyptian and Arabs I want you to know that half of my friends believe in coexisting and we do have Arab friends between us that's how I lived my entire life I live in Beva which is a coexist City many people in B are Arabs I don't
• 61:30 - 62:00 know where you are talking about and I invite you seriously I invite you to come to my country and I promise you that I will hold your hand and walk you through it and if you'll find anything with what you said in Israel I will do anything you want I will trust your agenda when I was taken to Gaza I was kidnapped I was caught three times on
• 62:00 - 62:30 the last time I was caught by 13 Hamas terrorist 13 you doesn't have to Don't force him I just want him to hear it he's a person he is entitled to have his own agenda and opinions we do not have to have the same opinions I just want you to know the facts that you talked about really right before the debate started I wanted to ask ask you where you from are you from here from the US okay I visited the US I have the
• 62:30 - 63:00 facts because I've been here have you visited Israel before no have you visited Gaza before probably not when he asked you what is a Palestinian and you couldn't answer it then I'm asking you what is a Gaza what is a Gaza civilian can you answer me I will answer to you when you're advocating for that and I'm telling you you're advocating
• 63:00 - 63:30 for not have rights for women to not have rights cuz women do not have rights in the Arab Society you're advocating for people you know you're talking about genocide well I'm here to say when October 7 happened and that's a fact they told me it in the inside they didn't know about the Nova Festival music they didn't know that we have 3,000 people in there they planned and
• 63:30 - 64:00 they told me that they planned to move on and kill as much as they could in Beva in Tel Aviv in Kaa they wanted to slaughter everybody you know what maybe you will not believe me I can present you my videos that I took there do you know how many budes I saw sorry I didn't see it my friends do you know how many buddies were there do you know how much violence was taken on me I was caught in the middle of a
• 64:00 - 64:30 Lynch I was presented as a soldier because I chose to wear green army lookalike uniform that day by mistake I was C categorized as a soldier and I was treated as a soldier I'm 40 years old look at me I'm 40 years old I have a dog and a cat I had two cats I lost one I have a mother and a father and a
• 64:30 - 65:00 sister and a brother that left their entire lives to try to help me my mother found out and if to be specific my 12-year-old niece I don't know if you have nephews but my 12-year-old niece found out a video on Tik Tok that's how my parents found out that I was kidnapped did you know that cuzz I I wish that we
• 65:00 - 65:30 can have a private conversation not with this whole audience cuz it's terrifying me to hear people have that thoughts and I really want to hear your side I swear really that's me that's my agenda of coexisting but I'm asking you do you deny that October 7 happened basic answer B basic question no no okay do you support the action of October 7th
• 65:30 - 66:00 no I know and I never have supported the killing of innocent cili what would happen What would happen if the Army couldn't stop them and they would continued would you support that we went to dance we went to dance we didn't an attack all wait you're asking me if I would support the continued killing of civilians on October 7th you if you support the actions of people going to music festival which is supporting
• 66:00 - 66:30 Freedom don't be don't get annoying I'm really asking you as a person do you support those actions no I know and I've already said I don't support the killing of civilians okay okay okay if you don't support those actions and October 7th didn't happen would we sit here talking right now well yeah actually we probably would
• 66:30 - 67:00 yeah I think so did you ever saw our people attacking that amount of people from the start from our side I'm asking simple question I don't understand in politic yes yes have you seen it for send you mean okay you keep on going do you mean was I in Gaza when they were attacking during operation prod I mean I
• 67:00 - 67:30 can't really when I was entering Gaza and I I told you before I have Arab suppliers I have Arab neighbors and Arab friends what I was entering Gaza and there is a video of that I saw 100% of civilians celebrating me being taken I didn't know about the other hostages I thought it was only me I didn't know about that all I saw is 100% of
• 67:30 - 68:00 civilians lynching me beating me up I was with a broken leg I had bruises all over my body do you know that I've never cursed them I've never argued with them and I've never treated them like garbage I respected them even when they abused me cuz I believe that if I want to be respected I have to respect everybody
• 68:00 - 68:30 else so I'm asking you one thing and one thing only because I see you're not comfortable I'm asking you to check facts on both sides it makes life better and I had the privilege to be on both side and I told you I started from a place that I didn't watch the news for 11 years just because of that talk to people private conversation
• 68:30 - 69:00 that's the real facts that's for me don't [Music] CL all right thank you Mor on thank you very I'm sorry for what you experienced but why I really would be hon have a private youan whatever you want you can we can t
• 69:00 - 69:30 can human you can do whatever you want whatever I really want to I you know what I wish him all the pain of the victims of this conflict on both sides no no no never wish that anyone he sooner or later is going to realize this for just being in such denial and I respected you you did not have to go to the personal staff to tell me if I'm paid or I gave you the opportunity to represent your case you did not need to to attack
• 69:30 - 70:00 me personally get more into that um more more more more into [Music] us take picture no not right now it's because we will create chaos just maybe all over the same the same purpose
• 70:00 - 70:30 in okay yeah it's written in so many different and and in Styles if you want to call it you know uh like I said NLP you know what the [ __ ] we're doing here you know I cannot believe you know just those conversations when you lived and I told you I lived in E Jerusalem just speak with these people who they wrote their own history they wrote a Lally made up their own books his I'm it just it just I I'm really reducing myself
• 70:30 - 71:00 talking to this kid just it's like he came he came really prepared no no no what I you know what I mean by prepared he he memorized the narrative and he just like even perfect it more than those whor been claiming it for 70 years he knows a lot more than yat on Palestine only take this whole effort take it to a positive place the dialogue is not going to
• 71:00 - 71:30 work dial end I can wear this next to your friends I a sellout for uh saving human lives but he's the uh the hero advocating on behalf of the uh victims of course not so let's go like this for WR and and but here's the thing protest they like there are Jewish people people who wear stars of David in the encampment for people who have shirts that say Jews against genocide
• 71:30 - 72:00 it's not especially like the fact that Jewish people are discriminate against in Gaza and in the west just wrong I need I need the sinir here at Point black you know and this is where we finish the business you know who kills who first and we're done but this dialogue was this you show it in a TW way that we supporting the yeah but it's not working this way this it can work in this way wait wait
• 72:00 - 72:30 wait listen there is a war physical War right okay but there is much much worse and bigger war in the social where where where isid the Young The Young Generation okay I'm not even uh considering that generation I'm old to your generation you have to use it better wisely because when you do that it's like what happened today when one say when one is against one and you have the vast majority of your hair they will clap hands together
• 72:30 - 73:00 that's why I as them that's why I ask them not to clap hands I don't need the support I want you to understand that I want to see what yeah I think so I think so but we want to make sure that there is no trap outside okay probably if you have if you have a car maybe you can help me a little bit just get the safe zone out of this like danger zone then from there I I can take it from there going out from you those universities you'll become the leaders one day use it wisely but okay but can
• 73:00 - 73:30 you at least understand that what some of what we're protesting is real and it's happening and this is what we don't want to see happen you know what it's happening in both sides reality check it happens all over there are bad people and good people in all the places yes I'm here to say you know what I was in a building that has tons of children in it tons of children and I used to I couldn't see anything okay I could just hear and when I heard them play in the
• 73:30 - 74:00 street it's like you know it's what part music of the DAT for me thank you for coming up and thank you right now because everybody would want to do that apprciate it um I you know what it took me an urge but I'm I'm thankful to myself that I didn't use it as in in my angry way cuz I'm a ran I'm can be really mad no but seriously I really want you to to hear me I don't want you to at me I want to I want to be able to stand next to you have different opinions but we can still live together
• 74:00 - 74:30 you guys take your seats back where you were I that's we can continue talking have a seat part of the mission of what we want to see accomplished is Jewish people in Palestinians living together yeah but it doesn't show it's it's not showing when you blocking Jewish students for going into universities and you can agree with me that's what the first step that was the
• 74:30 - 75:00 first step um that's violence my friend even even if it doesn't used violence that's violence when you what you did is what happened to me my freedom was taken I couldn't choose and do what I want they wanted to go to school you took their freedom that's the thing you don't understand in that case in that case it's not really comparable because never were people on Camp so the whole idea that they were stopped from going in because they were Jewish they were stopped because they're Jewish it shows
• 75:00 - 75:30 in the videos no I was there I was there oh yeah they weren't stop because they were they sto because there was worry that they would be [Music] antagonized speaking here um minut yeah one minute for question my question is to Mr of Y as an Israeli for a very long time I feel extremely helpless and I don't get any I
• 75:30 - 76:00 I don't have much motivation I wanted to ask you what would you say to the influencers to the celebrities to the sandin to the Hadid to all of them what would you say to them because their voices is so loud and ours is so small okay thank you and we just take a minut yes um so we are dealing with a situation where a bunch of uh
• 76:00 - 76:30 opportunists taking advantage of Palestine all of a sudden we have people so Indo indoctrinated by artificial intelligence and by Hamas propaganda who just basically uh spreading false narrative and it looks like they are a lot more educated than yaser arat on the topic so we have a new generation of people who uh live in uh virtual reality this
• 76:30 - 77:00 is those are the influencers with tens of thousands of following and uh they want to build encampment Mister he's building encampment on UCLA and I say what's next well this was a situation in Gaza 70 years ago they started with encampment the loser victim mentality they built encampment then later on it became tunnels and lunch missiles So I says to this uh type of mentality what's going to be next are you going to start digging tunnels here
• 77:00 - 77:30 at UCLA and possibly launch missiles at Beverly Hills this is the victim mentality that I'm totally against and it cannot be legitimized they have been and he say you know I don't validate the killing of civilians but in the meantime he thinks Hamas is resistance and he thinks resisting occupation that never happened because Palestine never existed you think that this is legitimate so if it's
• 77:30 - 78:00 not directly indirectly this influencers are complicit in Hamas crimes do do you have um Moran do you have anything just anything to to say okay I was not focusing this question Mr Doyle you don't have to if you don't want to we can go on another okay next question
• 78:00 - 78:30 thank you for being here very short question uh this is from Mr Doyle what is a Zionist and considering their historical and cultural ties to the land as well as your view of Justice where should Jews and Israel go if the state of Israel was to no longer exist thank you uh the Jews in Israel if the state of Israel to no longer exist should stay there and should have equal rights under the law um that's why at least at
• 78:30 - 79:00 least answer the first question next that's why um as somebody who identifies as prop Palestinian and somebody who I think has the same views as many Americans on on the topic what we want to see is equal rights for everyone and what we see now is that not being the case uh now in terms of what is a Zionist I mean there's there's a bunch of different types of zionists but um probably the most generic answer um and I'm guessing you're you want to know what like the average well you all know
• 79:00 - 79:30 what a aist is you want to know what the average pro Palestinian person in America thinks is a Zionist it's just somebody who wants to uh establish a Jewish state in the land of uh in the region of Israel and Palestine I I don't wait so where should the Jews in Israel go under your sense of justice yeah that was the last part of the question yeah yeah that's what I answered first is that they should stay essentially where they are and have equal rights under the law so should Jews be able to live in Palestine if there was a two-state solution if there was a two yeah yeah of
• 79:30 - 80:00 course okay Vita your your choice hi thank you all for being here my question is for Mr Doyle I heard you mention the starving as a component of genocide and I wanted to know why is it Israel's burden to provide food to gazin and not Hamas the actual government of Gaza um why do the three leaders of Hamas is hania Musa maruk and Khaled Masha who are collectively worth1 billion not responsible for feeding
• 80:00 - 80:30 their own people right so understanding why Hamas isn't able to feed their own people you have to understand uh the agricultural situation of Gaza which is that they're only agriculturally independent in two ways and that's fruits and vegetables which means that with the over population of the land 2 million people in a 25 mile strip and with the relative lack of certainly right now agriculture there's no there's no growing of food whatsoever um being uh um uh uh
• 80:30 - 81:00 agriculturally and therefore being able to survive by themselves without any exports is actually impossible now this actually the reason for this dates back to 1967 when uh the occupation of Gaza began and you can say whether it was an occupation or not uh there were settlements in Gaza uh they took 20% of the land and they imposed laws on Gaza that Pro specifically prohibited new um agricultural agriculture from flourishing ing in Gaza which means that they did things like Banning the planting of more than one tree they made sure that all agricultural experts went
• 81:00 - 81:30 through Israeli vendors um and so this um I don't think it's controversial to say systemic repression of the agriculture of Gaza um and also the subsequent overpopulation of Gaza and the uh disallowing of anybody to leave or anybody get in um has resulted in um a situation mostly with regard to the actual survival of the gazen people through food that is completely untenable um and then you talk about uh why is it the Israeli Israel's responsibility to
• 81:30 - 82:00 feed the people of Gaza well um it's Israel's responsibility because they were the ones who imposed the blockade in 2005 they're the ones who don't allow trade to happen they're the ones who um maybe not entirely but at least certainly is partially are responsible for the economic Devastation that's happened not in Gaza not just uh since October 7th but before that as well um and also because before October 7th uh 5 trucks some of which were provided by Israel a lot of which were provided by the UN were uh CED were were driven into
• 82:00 - 82:30 Gaza and now the number is hovering around 160 um oxam as you know as you probably know has has reported that there are some God and children surviving on less than 245 calories um a day but the responsibility the responsibility um so so whether Goin are dying or not um is is absolutely true the responsibility lies on Israel because of their actions with regard to Gaza in the past now if you're saying that let me just I'll just finish really quick I'll just yeah I'll just finish really quick if you're saying that that
• 82:30 - 83:00 um that the leaders of Hamas should do a better job of um a better job of guiding Hamas or leading Hamas and taking care of the Palestinian people I I actually agree okay okay hold on one sec one second um you want to comment on this subject specifically um I'm a skinny person and I I lost 12% of my body weight inside captivity while my guards was eating in front of my face and I'm
• 83:00 - 83:30 here to tell you that like I was speaking to you privately before as a soldier I know how to observe let's say it like that okay and I was tracking the uh how do to say the merchandise that came the the brands of the food it comes from the same place okay and that's the merchandise that they bring to support Gaza do you know who takes that that merchandise do you know who has food all the time in their houses Hamas soldiers
• 83:30 - 84:00 of course the civilians will not have it and I'm I moved seven places and I saw between 40 to 50 Kama soldiers they look good they didn't lost weight no I I actually would agree with that that Hamas should do a better job of taking care of their civilians but um what what doesn't change the the fact is that even if Hamas didn't hoard the food um if they do that to a large extent universally even if if they didn't do that Hamas would still be starving all excuse me Gaza would still
• 84:00 - 84:30 be starving sorry Gaza would still be starving that's how that's true they working they going into Israel they have their merchandise and the market they told it themselves that the food got expensive now not before it was okay the process was okay did you know that they get uh discount in electricity that we don't get and we sear the electricity do you know that we pay more I pay more as a citizen in Israel than the Gaza people did you know that probably not we give them electricity we give them the electricity in the water right so it's
• 84:30 - 85:00 the same electricity right I pay more not no yeah yeah yeah they they they give they give electricity Gaza which I think kind of illustrates perfectly I didn't have electricity just just saying I sit in a dark room no I know Hamas taking captives was was horrible and people who were responsible of that should be put in prison um but the um of them but uh but the the fact that Gaza has to be given electricity and they
• 85:00 - 85:30 cannot do sustain that by themselves um is indicative of the horrific uh the horrific uh conditions of Gaza right now and before is is that okay let let me let me just hold on a second hold on a second the thing that's seems to be missing and I'm not criticizing what you're saying I'm just like noticing that the thing that's missing from your commentary is why and why is their control of these things in Gaza is it just because Israelis don't like gazans
• 85:30 - 86:00 or is it because they're worried about their self-preservation and they have to control things to prevent things from coming over the border is that is that well as a part of controlling Gaza they have um uh they have completely decimated not only uh the civilian infrastructure but the the agriculture the economy of Gaza I'm saying as a part of controlling it so uh destroying the agriculture of Agriculture of Gaza as they did as I
• 86:00 - 86:30 said 1967 has nothing to do with with safety so if you're asking is the reason that Israel is is has this embargo on Gaza because they're worried about their own safety well there's two answers to that well one no it clearly isn't because um they have uh they have put into place repressive policies in Gaza long before Hamas even existed but secondly um that and as we know if uh as we know this these kind of repressive policies only increase the hatred um if they wanted to
• 86:30 - 87:00 actually find uh make peace then they wouldn't be uh instituting embargos now it goes beyond that that the Embargo in 2006 was actually in violation of the ceasefire that they signed um with Hamas and so Israel's consistent violation of ceasefire agreements and peace deals um is is something that is not talked about nearly enough and indicates that Israel is not just worried about their own safety they're worried about um making sure that uh uh they maintain the uh discri the uh discriminatory policies
• 87:00 - 87:30 that oppress the Palestinians in Israel and in Gaza and okay I think um I think hold on I I think I I would like to ask you where you're getting that information from because it seems like there's been quite a few um breaches of ceasefires by Hamas that I don't hear any times that Israel is initiating those breaches but but um and I know you disagree with me but let's take some more questions just want to set the play set the playing field a little bit so uh we're going to start limiting the answers to 2 minutes so we can get
• 87:30 - 88:00 through this cuz we want to really get all these people's uh questions answered yes over here uh we've got um some people over here uh Vita could you you got it you got the mic all right I have two questions for Mr doy I'll get them out as quickly as possible and I hope you can answer both of them number one um number one you insistently evoked the Holocaust by accusing Jewish Israelis of genocide and putting Palestinians in con concentration camps the IH definition of anti-semitism
• 88:00 - 88:30 includes strong comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis so do you a believe the international Holocaust remembrance Alliance has misdefined anti-Semitism or B are you an AOW anti-em anti-semite That's A or B what's the definition it includes it includes drawn comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis you you said you use Jewish Israelis of genocide and putting Palestinians in concentration camps so that's question one that's just a or b there's no option C my second question
• 88:30 - 89:00 is there's an undeniable violent Orthodoxy among your movement in the encampment in particular where anyone who advocates for the unconditional release of the hostages or the destruction of Hamas is physically attacked or blocked out of public spaces so I'm grateful that you're here for a relatively civilized conversation but how is your violent exclusionist anti-semitic movement helping anything and do you have a solution for the region any ideas about the hostage crisis other than globalizing the
• 89:00 - 89:30 inata yeah so uh the definition of anti-semitism by uh the what was it called the international Holocaust remembrance Alliance International Holocaust Rememberance Alliance yeah that's ridiculous you can compare um no no it is ridiculous well because you can compare uh Trump to Hitler and nobody calls you what anti-trump it's just or anti nobody calls you racist for that it's ridic you can compare the policies of of modern governments whether it's Israel the United States Britain Iran uh to anybody else now keep in mind that um
• 89:30 - 90:00 Israel consistently Compares Hamas to Nazis and yet nobody calls them islamophobic so that's an absurd definition uh it's uh uh anti-Semitism is the hatred of Jewish people not the comparison of one government to another that's that's absurd but secondly no no so so secondly the the encampment wasn't uh anti-semitic in fact there were no no it actually it actually actually wasn't um no no I'm telling you it wasn't so so
• 90:00 - 90:30 no so um so in the encampment class everybody saw it no Jews were actually allowed to go to class El je yes they were I was in the encampment I was in the encampment you're wrong Jews were allowed to go to class Jews were allowed to go to class um hold on hold on hold on hold on Jewish students were allowed to go to class and and there were and on Wednesday when the cameon was taken down there were hundreds of Jewish students there how about zist how about Zionist we're Zionist the actually actually Zionist yeah zist digging into the
• 90:30 - 91:00 ENC no agit no agitators were removed yeah no no no no allowed in the camp yes or no I am I I am allowed in the camp yes or no okay okay one one at time I know a lot of people want to talk to me too many people please please time's up okay yeah yeah asking people
• 91:00 - 91:30 they yes you please stand behind that because that's the TR all right so so you know what you let me just let me just ask a a different thing here to you Mr Doyle what what uh do you think that your conduct and your encampments conduct at UCLA would make Jewish students at UCLA uncomfortable enough so that they would be scared to
• 91:30 - 92:00 walk to their class through the encampment or next to the encampment no right okay did you ever experience any Jewish students being expressing Their Fear or expressing their displeasure in it uh not to me personally I'm I've seen it on social media but I've also seen um I've also seen people scream they don't let Jews into the encampment directly at Jewish students so the idea that we don't let Jewish as soon as anything came in it's just it's just ABD it's just ridiculous not true do seriously
• 92:00 - 92:30 you didn't see Jewish people coming to the campuses and people stand in line not speaking a word and physically don't let them get in in several several campuses serious no because people in the audience you can answer this as well there did you not see Jewish students in the encampment yeah but who started again who started what who started the demonstration who started to block Jewish students from going into campuses no no no wait wait wait wait no no no no
• 92:30 - 93:00 seriously students were blocked from being the encampment it had nothing to do with their identity all right let's go uh you got a you got a question over there yeah malro over there how yall doing how yall doing how y doing I got got I got a question uh my name is m roay wat Jones I just graduated today from UCLA congratulations I got I got a I got a question for brother Aiden doya now uh when I first came to your encampment on Friday April
• 93:00 - 93:30 26 I was a staunch Pro Palestinian supporter if you look at my music video LA riots that was shot with funding from a family whose son was killed by the LAPD and uh they were able to uh help me to get their message across you know I've always been a supporter of what you're a part of now and when I came into that encampment do you know what happened to me you guys Mook me for a Jewish student so by mistaking me for a Jewish student you guys physically attack me lecturers grad students undergrad students you
• 93:30 - 94:00 guys push me around with open palms and I'm an African-American student and you didn't came on this stage today and brought up Zimbabwe brought up Africa now you didn't said a lot of things about how it don't matter where you was born at but I know in my hood in South La on 48th in Compton when we did something they was shooting us with bullets when you guys came up against the police after you assaulted Elanor beat her unconscious and that's when the uh Community came to approach y'all y'all got hit with rubber bullets and you got a citation let's be honest so my
• 94:00 - 94:30 question to you is this if you say that your movement was peaceful and your movement was about Palestine then why was y'all assault in black students white men like you why was y'all attacking us if if if you if you if you believe in rights against oppression while my daddy was born before the Civil Rights Act was passed and you stopped his son the first graduate of University in our family and y'all put y hands all over me and y'all put y' foot on my daughter stroller and
• 94:30 - 95:00 y'all did it on camera and everything with no shame at the end of the day every single member of SJP is going to face the RICO Act because y'all are a criminal organization so answer me this answer me this answer me this answer me this if you're a peaceful movement and you respect the rights of citizens why did y'all violate my rights yes I don't know how many times I have to say but nobody wasn't allowed in the cment on basis of their [Music]
• 95:00 - 95:30 identity yeah yeah you can say whatever you want it's not true you would ask students before they walked into the library if they believe that Israel has the right to exist and if they said yes you wouldn't let them in and we have proof of that no there actually people there actually people many people in the encampment uh who have a wide variety of correct and that is a lie and everybody here knows it and you know it you know it's a lie no no no I was actually in
• 95:30 - 96:00 the encampment I was actually in the encampment and I talk to people some well if you want to listen to what I'm going to say you can stop stop yell stop y stop yelling please okay we've got we've heard you we've all educated it doesn't fit your narrative right now but that's the truth man we got your point we got your point thank you we got your point about 15 minutes ago Okay so um so as I said there's a Mr do Mr Doyle hold on a second we I think we've got yours let's get the next let's get the next question
• 96:00 - 96:30 hey everybody yeah yeah actuallyit why did you have yeah yeah I'll answer the question um well as as you know on Tuesday we were all the entire encampment was attacked by a violent mob of counter protesters No in fact in fact I actually still have a mark for when I was stabbed by a metal rod rod so so fear of Violence by agitators was a very real very real thing okay next question
• 96:30 - 97:00 question hello uh hi uh we can just yeah actually we didn't give uh Mr Doyle a chance to respond because a lot of stuff was going on but malago said something your question the same thing so just be patient so everyone can ask their question and you guys can continue this as we go along but don't yell at him because then we can't get the dialog yeah um malago asked a question you should answer it and then let's move
• 97:00 - 97:30 on yeah uh no nobody violated your rights um the there were instance there were instances we didn't violate your I've literally told you like five times already you can sit down now yeah so so people were removed were removed from the encampment it was because of the fear of agitation and we actually saw that agitation when um uh men and women in the encampment College age
• 97:30 - 98:00 students were were uh throwing firecrackers at were assaulted okay hold on though you're not answering his question his question was about to him and his daughter his 9-year-old daughter so let's NOS have been thrown they the encampment y'all started violate maray ail people were people were moved from the encampment because of fear of violence and agitation that's why no but what do you I I wanted you to respond to what he's saying are you just are you just denying that what he said you are you denying what he said no I said people were removed from the encampment
• 98:00 - 98:30 okay all right let's move to the next question hello uh thank you for the quick transition to my question uh my name's uh Taj V Singh I'm actually a UCA student and uh I want to ask a question uh sort of delving away from the personal stuff here and getting on to what the situation is going to look like in the future so I know someone said there hasn't been a question for Mr Yousef so this is for both Mr Dole and Mr Yousef if my question is how do you see this conflict ending and why or why not is that resolution adequate in
• 98:30 - 99:00 creating long-term peace and stability in the region um it directed to any particular I can just answer super super quickly then M can um there needs to be one state solution with equal rights um and protections for everybody and an equal alloc relatively equal distribution of the land for both Jews Muslims and Christians and that means that the government no no no that means that that no the government of Hamas Palestinian Authority and the Israeli government none of them are are perfectly suitable
• 99:00 - 99:30 to do this but it would it would require a lot of cooperation between the three one Arab country where how would How would how would that work when there's a good number of the population in the Arab in the Palestinian uh territories that do not want that should we model no there are a number of there number of people in Israel don't want a one state solution there number of people in a lot of people in palestin don't want a one state solution wait wait wait wait wait how can you say wait how can the
• 99:30 - 100:00 question but how can you have a discussion with none of the Hamas Representatives sitting here now and he will never sit here right now how can you have both sides facts if only one side is volunteer to sit here at all time in any place you'll ask him to did you see any one of the Kamas comes to sit here to debate to discussion and that's a that's a really that's a question I was going to ask you at the end is why is it that you think that
• 100:00 - 100:30 you're the only person that we got to come up here to speak from your side of the issue yeah I can't speak for the people who who didn't want to speak um but what I can just can say is that the view of Hamas as a completely implacable force is not completely uh incorrect because they see the pal Palestinian issue as a very religious issue and going back on that issue is seen as going back on God but like we saw with the PLO over time uh they become more of a political movement and less of a nationalist movement like we'll see with Hamas uh like we've seen with the change
• 100:30 - 101:00 from 1987 Charter to 1917 Charter Charter they change they Chang and they adapt and they grow over time and it's changing from a stly religious movement obviously it's it's it still is a very much religious movement but the movement itself especially with regard toas becomes more political and becomes more malleable uh the idea is that in in in time um if we can get Israel Hamas both agree to a just solution then it's it's ridiculous to say well oh because Hamas um is imp placable now then they won't
• 101:00 - 101:30 there won't be a solution because Israel has also been control the the city Hamas controls the city okay I said with one of the guards okay and I tried to make him picture himself flying to Thailand or a different country it took me only 30 days bless you it took me only 30 days to do so when he tried to to imagine when he reached to the peck of the imagination like you know to do like that he it took
• 101:30 - 102:00 me 30 days to make him do that eventually he fell to the chair back and said oh I can but the Kamas will shoot me do you know that they are not allowed to get out yeah yeah Oh wrong so but they they control the city do you understand that know I disagree with I don't really I'm not but do you understand that the Hamas controls the city which means it controls the civilians which means he controls any outcome or what will happen to the C do you understand that sorry no
• 102:00 - 102:30 I I hope I've made it clear that I'm I'm not don't really defend Hamas that much yeah but the Hamas controls Gaza yeah it's a new on situation stay with me Hamas controls Gaza yeah do we agree on that they control some of God they control some of uh okay thank you look the problem is not only with Hamas it looks like we have to please so many
• 102:30 - 103:00 opposing forces uh we try to please Hamas then we have a problem with the Islamic Jihad then we have a if we please Islamic Jihad we have a problem with the public front we please this then we have to uh go to Fida then we have to go to national uh we have about 12 Palestinian factions and all of them have different idea of what Palestine is and what can satisfy their political ambition then
• 103:00 - 103:30 now we have Mr Dylan and we have a million like him in the United States that we also they became legitimate force in the conflict so Israel will have to also bring them to the negotiating table and try to please uh their political ambition as well so as you see each one of them is basically a black whole that cannot be satisfied and all of them have one thing in common and that's not to build a
• 103:30 - 104:00 Palestine it's only to delegitimize Israel that's the only thing they know how to do because if you ask him practically how can he actually construct a model of Palestine if he's never been there if he was actually a sincere person he would take a flight and go to Gaza and feel the people and see their suffering firsthand or if it's too dangerous for him I
• 104:00 - 104:30 wouldn't blame him probably would be he would be very terrified to be Gaza it's too much at least go to the West Bank you can go to the city of rala live with the people for a couple of years understand their culture and when I say couple of years is not enough in order to know the mentality of the people you have to spend with them a decade at least of daily experience to understand what they stand for before you start advocating on their behalf you just
• 104:30 - 105:00 taking the side against Israel for killing Gaza children ignoring the reality that Hamas is using them as civilians as human Shields and I've been telling you this from day one that you have been used by Hamas they want you to cause chaos they want the global chaos they want to put pressure on the US government on the Israel government and all other democracies they want to bring the civiliz Civilized world to its knees from those ugly images that we see from
• 105:00 - 105:30 the war but Israel did not initiate that war on October 7th Hamas did and our problem is not only with Hamas is with the Palestinian ideology that you just want to gift Hamas and other Fanatics a Palestinian State thinking that this is going to bring a solution this is going to create a Global chaos this people are not looking for Equal Opportunity they don't want to divide the land if they
• 105:30 - 106:00 wanted uh to divide the land they would have accepted the partition back in 1948 but instead of declaring their independence they declared war against the Jewish people then they remembered some 40 years later to declare their independence this is the Palestinians or what socalled Palestinians they have many many fundamental problems they don't have a legitimate leadership you know you told me about the camp and like you speak on behalf of all the
• 106:00 - 106:30 encampment in the United States you run only a camp here at UCLA there are other encampments you are not in charge of them and you they did not even elect you as a leadership you don't have a moral uh Compass you don't have an objective out of this thing you're just going uh in a revolution for the sake of revolution in in father and you don't have a resolution where where are you where are you getting what's the next
• 106:30 - 107:00 Shore so fundamentally uh we have a problem with Palestine before we resolve this issue we need the Palestinians to decide what they want first of all what's their constitution what's their agenda what's their leadership and will they drop violence as a method will they accept Israel right to exist then after that we can have a dialogue and there there can be a solution but as long as they want
• 107:00 - 107:30 to annihilate the state of Israel kill their own children sacrifice civilians only for uh uh your sympathy and the rest of the world's sympathy then this uh cycle of violence will never end so first of all the force narrative must end then the use of violence has to be dropped complet completely and unconditionally targeting civilians uh indiscriminately then after that there would be room for dialogue and
• 107:30 - 108:00 negotiations uh if I if I may please add up to it the basic needs you know in4 gay people women other basic stuff that you know are not allowed in there so try to think what you support I just one point of clarification from Mr Yousef this would be really quick I understand the characterization of Palestine and Hamas but I think the question the answer you gave was a
• 108:00 - 108:30 little retrospective I guess I'm asking what do you think not what it should be like but what it will look like and is that a uh good solution or good uh way to create stability in the region look the children of the region you know before they were uh uh the Palestinian identity was enforced on them they're just children uh they Arab children there are
• 108:30 - 109:00 Jewish children there are Jew children and all ethnicities can get along Arabs and Jews can't get along uh and I lived that era before the First Palestinian intifada things were okay Jewish families used to come to our village and dine with us we used to go to theirs My Father by the way as a Hamas leader I remember him prior to the first intifa serving food with his own hands
• 109:00 - 109:30 that was just one or two years before the First Palestinian intifa and we coexisted together there was no checkpoints there was no wall there was no stabbing but then the intifa came and this is when everything changed so in my opinion if the Palestinian violent idea ideology and of antifa of violence of globalizing the antifa of delegitimizing
• 109:30 - 110:00 Israel of canceling Israel right to exist If this nonsense is dropped eventually I think Arabs and Jews can get along but first we have to drop the ideology and this is where I have my problem my fundamental problem what is Palestine and what is the purpose of Palestine if you want to talk about security there could be a peacekeeping force it does not have to be a militia carrying big guns to just secure the the
• 110:00 - 110:30 cities make sure that the women and the children are safe then we can invest in economy and we can invest in education and it does not have to be a state at all you know for example they can have the name of a state uh take for example the Vatican it's it's a state Without Borders but it's one of the most powerful states in the world and Palestinians don't have to
• 110:30 - 111:00 control the borders and have an army and uh ER become uh existential threat to the state of Israel so my personal opinion there have to be transitional uh Point uh period where uh the what so-called Palestinians or Arabs are put the test that they are able to coexist with Israel and after that we can do it step by step towards total cooperation
• 111:00 - 111:30 between the Jews and the Arabs the only threat in the way and this is my concern is the Palestinian ideology Moran do you have a I don't think we can talk about future when we still have brothers and sisters side and I'm a person of coexistence like I said please really we we we want us to respect us all equally um I can
• 111:30 - 112:00 talk about peace and I'm a peace Seeker when I have literally brothers and sisters sitting down on mattresses not seeing daylight for over almost 300 days um so I I think that after our hostages will come back home our people who come back home there is a possibility to speak about freedom and um I'm here to say one thing and one thing only about
• 112:00 - 112:30 that if you keep repeating the same lesson with the same outcome if you repeat again and again and again and again that's how history repeats itself that's that easy if you want to change something change your ways cuz what you're doing now I'm sorry to say this is exactly what the Kamas told me in side and if you go and hear my interviews on Google you will hear exact that the exact
• 112:30 - 113:00 that Kamas woke up every morning and say I have no emotion my Holiness is to kill and be killed when I asked them because we were in houses when I asked them say is this house belong to a family and he said yes so we took their clothes he said yes so we took their food he said yes so I said so how is it different that what you say is happening to your
• 113:00 - 113:30 people oh they don't care they take their own houses of their own people you can't educate people with the same lesson with the same outcome every single time you want to do you want to make a change change your ways choose something different so thank you [ __ ] um are there any uh people who support uh prop Palestinian movement in the audience that would like to ask a [Music]
• 113:30 - 114:00 question yes we need a microphone over there you want to yeah thank you my name is Renee um Aiden I commend you for can you hear me okay my name is Renee and I'm from Jordan and I grew up there Aidan as a young man I
• 114:00 - 114:30 commend you for putting on a suit and coming out here tonight I appreciate that from a professor okay but you also have to have enough humility to know that you don't know enough and I'm telling you that as an Arab so where would I rather live Tel Aviv or Gaza who would I rather live amongst Hamas which is what you're advocating for I also believe that it's
• 114:30 - 115:00 d words and your actions are incredibly dangerous so you're not doing my people any good by these encampments if anything you're empowering Hamas his Allah Isis and the plethora that are kind of in in breeding right now so like I said I appreciate you know you putting on a suit and coming here and speaking for my people my people don't want you speaking for them because you're not
• 115:00 - 115:30 helping us you're you're not you can shake your head shake your head you can shake your head I don't claim to speak for the people of Jordan I don't know what the Jordan Palestine same thing listen don't be rude man they're not the same thing it's not the same thing but no actually here's the thing here's one thing you don't know hold on hold on let her speak before the British mandate I could have been a Palestinian instead of a Jordanian or Egyptian it's the same people so don't act like you know my
• 115:30 - 116:00 people better than myself or Yousef so that's the arrogance that I have encampments that's this is the arrogance and the problem that I have with the encampments I came here tonight with a [ __ ] taser because you think you're protesting peacefully I'm going to be okay showing up here by myself because white entitled spoiled Americans want to get attention that's what you're standing up for you're making it worse for Arabs
• 116:00 - 116:30 here and back home so you're not doing any of us any I have a question for you can I ask a question not regarding politicians yeah let's any other uh Pro Palestinian uh students or uh adults can I ask a small question a small question like a really friendly question what will happen if me and you will text and we'll meet up in a bar in the middle of the US next to the campus just with your
• 116:30 - 117:00 agenda me with me opinions and then your friends will see you from the side what will happen you mean my friends from the encampment your friends that supports the same agenda that you support and I'm wearing my SAR David and all my Judaism science what will happen if they'll see you in a casual conversation with me I think they'd probably be fine with it I was I was disconnected from
• 117:00 - 117:30 civilization for two months it took me half a minute to understand that something will happen to me I I was forbidden to speak Hebrew in London next to students you know that because they feared my life I'm not allowed to put start of David in many many cities did you know that that's wrong that shouldn't happen but it happens because students support it I'm not afraid I don't I don't support well you're talking to me I don't so do let's meet
• 117:30 - 118:00 up tomorrow in your campus yeah next to the you Aiden you want to meet with her uh yeah sure all right great that's progress um any pro Palestinian people here that would like to speak um I am not self-described as Pro Palestinian but I am Pro human rights so I'm going to ask regardless um first I would like to sayem for your safe return and we are very happy to have you here with
• 118:00 - 118:30 us I would also like to thank masab from the bottom of my heart for being here as well you've been a great voice for the Jewish people and we appreciate you my after reading your book masab I learned that even the most radical people can be deradicalized so in the face of bigotry and anti-Semitism on college campuses and across the world how do we go about deradicalized more people like Mr
• 118:30 - 119:00 Doyle look um ideology is a construct and this is I speak from a personal experience because I was able to change uh the way I think and the way I perceive reality but requ Ires lots of Courage that we we should work on ourselves and be able to drop our false identities not actually impower
• 119:00 - 119:30 them um Palestine or Palestinian um again it's a construct and we can deconstruct that but first of all we need either to drop it completely or to reshape it of something that is useful and this what I'm saying you want to be a Palestinian I don't have a problem if they insist on that identity ideology
• 119:30 - 120:00 then I have no problem but I need to see their uh Constitution what actually makes them Palestinians and how can I satisfy their needs their their their wants their ambition and who is the leadership am I talking to students on uh U UCLA campus that they're completely irrelevant to the reality of the Middle
• 120:00 - 120:30 East that actually don't have a connection or power to force Hamas to release one hostage or to force Hamas to step down and get out of the way of the Arab and Jewish children so they can live their life they don't have that kind of power they cannot convince Hamas Hamas won't listen to them they don't have
• 120:30 - 121:00 authority but they are working freely to Advocate on behalf of Hamas propaganda so we are not helping the situation we are empowering this ideology we're globalizing it and we are getting uh infinite forces from everywhere to take part of this
• 121:00 - 121:30 complicated uh Matrix uh of uh the Middle East so my suggestion first of all we need to localize it not globalize it and anti-war activity is something but to delegitimize a democracy by spreading all type of uh allegations like for example a genocide this is a very serious allegation and when the icj judge say
• 121:30 - 122:00 that there is no genocide then it's finished the people with the authority on the topic said the final verdict the final word but the pro Palestine and the encampment did not suit them well they wanted the genocide allegations to continue for eternity because it's serving their agendas now so I'll have to meet with every force that came to
• 122:00 - 122:30 join the cause the the angry cause how can we solve the problem we will never be able to solve the problem this way so we need to Lo localize the problem enough we don't want to globalize it and we need the people of the region who has the authority to decide for thems El I think today the Palestinians came to realize that violence is a dead end what Hamas
• 122:30 - 123:00 did a momentum of 36 years of violence what they what they achieved the destruction of Gaza and the suffering of so many civilians innocent children now they realize I think that this is a dead end they're going nowhere and I think this is the best inducation later on I hope for the Arabs of that region to elect and nominate uh a reasonable leadership that
• 123:00 - 123:30 cares for the future of the children and not to get them involved this vicious uh cycle of Violence by giving um nonsense uh Solutions and speaking on behalf of of um a region that we don't understand thank you any other uh Pro Palestinian people
• 123:30 - 124:00 here are you Pro Palestinian yeah okay no no back there back I don't know if I hi my name is Yahya and I've seen War question for Doyle I know you yourself but as you know most Palestinians do not accept a Jewish state in any border why could there be two 22 Arab
• 124:00 - 124:30 states 49 Muslim states but there can't be an Armenian State nor Kurdish State nor Jewish state which are minorities in the Middle East do you see yourself as being moral for only one type of people now I think I made it abundantly clear that uh the solution that I see um if you're representing yourself you're then what are you doing representing the
• 124:30 - 125:00 Palestinian cause like you're you're not part of the Palestinian cause does not want a Jewish state from The River To The Sea why are you representing a group of people that are totally like object to your opinion what do you no they don't I think there should be one I think there should be I think there should be one one with with equal rights for everyone that's my solution what he's saying that the Hamas the Hamas and the Palestinian want to eliminate Israel that's what
• 125:00 - 125:30 he's saying the Hamas the agenda of theas which is true it's saying it daily the Kamas agenda and the civilians agenda not most of them how it is not 100% support the same uh uh the same purpose but most of them wants to eliminate Israel eliminate which means to destroy and he not to move to a different place that's what he's saying that's it I was just sharpening it yeah so I guess the the premise of
• 125:30 - 126:00 the question is that um many Palestinians want to destroy Israel I think no it's no so so so a political situation in which the current the current state of Israel and the current state of palestin uh and whatever forms that they have taken up as of right now don't exist does not mean that the you w kill everyone in the region or kill all the Jewish people or kill all the Palestinians and I think that when Netanyahu says that he doesn't believe in a Palestinian State I don't take that
• 126:00 - 126:30 to mean that he wants to kill all the Palestinians just like when Hamas and their Charter say that he they don't believe in a Jewish State I don't take that to mean that he wants they want to kill all the Jews but if we don't support it that how you guys screaming in all right not isra yeah yeah so so the 1987 the 1987 yes the 1987 the 1987 I have the
• 126:30 - 127:00 microphone we got we got wrap it up here all right we we heard what you said um I'm here with the microphone sir can you st sit down please hold on don't see with open eyes what's going on in the Middle East it's not Palestinian if it's not Jews it's Iran yes oh and please please let's just put
• 127:00 - 127:30 on the table and put the money everywhere to destroy the Jews because the Jews is the little ones and then they'll go after the Gentiles then they'll go after anybody Iran has mulas that support the creation of of the Muslim world to be Muslim will have always a problem I've been in West Bank I sered to the West Bank have nothing against
• 127:30 - 128:00 Palestinian now I have something that you have to realize and if you don't realize you've been sponsored by Qatar which sponsored by Iran until you finish this molas running the world we'll have a problem I don't care what anybody says Palestinian themselves are peaceful people I'll be the first one I deal with them I do business with them as long as
• 128:00 - 128:30 Iran agitates and agitating means money support the extreme people have a problem maybe maybe maybe you should direct your question we're going to we're going to we're going to Sor I've got my microphone I've been waiting I have an important question this is for you doy all right this will be the last question for you yeah thank you we can do more of these if you want
• 128:30 - 129:00 okay so I'm not sure if you're aware of this but since about 2018 um there have been settlements of Palestinian families in Afrin which is the part of Kurdistan that's occupied by Syria and this has been a part of a movement to arabize the region and to decrease Kurdish presence there and it's
• 129:00 - 129:30 been with um financial support from the Palestinian Authority and other Arab states and this is just is again just one very recent example but I'm curious why you don't take into account pan arabism as an ideological movement of ethn and cultural hemony when you're discussing the things that are prolonging the conflict and um what that means and has
• 129:30 - 130:00 meant for minorities of the region and um how that has been a fuel for the ongoing resistance to any minority Independence or sovereignty including Jewish yeah good question so uh well the establishment of settlements in any region that results in the ethnic cleansing of that people whether it's Kurdish whether it's Palestinians whether it's whether it's uh anybody is
• 130:00 - 130:30 something that I in principle don't agree with so I don't agree with the creation of settlements in order to ethnically cleanse the Palestinian region but um if you're going to ask about pan arabism in the context of the the Palestinian uh the Israel Palestine conflict um well it's completely contradictory towards both the the pal the Authority and Hamas it's contradict towards Hamas because pan arabism is um in complete contradiction to any sort of Islamic State and it's in contradiction
• 130:30 - 131:00 to Palestinian nationalism the Palestinian flag identical then to the flag of the kingdom of to the flag of the B movement and what are the the symbolic representations of that flag to say that it's completely distinct independent nationalism then I want to know how you explain overlaps with other um yeah so the idea of a nation is as I said earlier on it is not uh whether you want to say that Palestinians are the
• 131:00 - 131:30 same as jordanians or the same as Lebanese well nations are not actually created based on ethnic uh lines rather they're created they're realized and or they're created and then the ethnic distinctions between na nations are realized and this has been the case across the world so any genetic similarities or any cultural similarities between Palestinians and jordanians or Palestinians and other Arab countries um is actually relevant and and first of all let me just let me just finish let me just finish because because well
• 131:30 - 132:00 first of all Palestinians are actually quite genetically distinct from other Arab countries like Saudi Arabia but but even if even if that's even if that's that's irrelevant um the existence of a Nation even if Palestinians were identical to every other Arab country that doesn't mean that they don't have a right to a nation and we've seen uh with no uh creation ofans have right to a na that's not my question arabism as an ideological agent in this conflict and opposition Regional
• 132:00 - 132:30 opposition to any minority sovereignty and that having been a shared agenda of multiple Arab Nations including the Palestinian nation and I'm this is consistently brushed away ignored in order to paint Zionism as an ideological agent against sort of a organic natural desire for nationalism which is what the Palestinians yeah yeah so so if pan
• 132:30 - 133:00 arabism was the do well for one pan arabism as a dominant ideology largely died out in the 60s and 70s but if you're asking about well as a as a dominant yeah yeah the Hamas chart is in complete contradiction to um to pan arabism it's they're literally ideologically completely completely distinct from each other it's impossible it's impossible for pan arabism to exist and the Hamas Islamic Charter for to exist but to on the question of question if pan arabism was was really as dominant as you as you said then uh the
• 133:00 - 133:30 existence of Lebanon as a nation as Jordan as a nation of Saudi Arabia as a nation they wouldn't exist all right thank you okay um This Woman's been very uh patient and really persistent so I'm going to give her a quick quick question um this question is for the both of you um what does from the river to the Sea Palestine will be free and uh in resistance by all means necessary mean to the both of you and also would
• 133:30 - 134:00 you be able to tell me what the gender aparte is in all of the neighboring countries around Israel gender apar towards women and the treatment of the LGBT community in all of the Arab countries besides Israel would you both be able to tell me I want both of you to answer these questions please thank you uh yeah sure well well from The
• 134:00 - 134:30 River To The Sea uh Palestine will be free all Palestinians are free from the occupation that they don't have to face discrimination that they don't have to uh face apartheid and that they don't have to face uh oppression by uh the Israeli government and that they don't have to face these constant incursions into Gaza which by the way are designed to to be asymmetrical to Target fan infrastructure and to make sure that mes has as little public support in Gaza as possible and next you said about the gender apartheid um it's actually not that hard for me to it's not that hard for me to uh to say that um women and
• 134:30 - 135:00 men should have equal rights in every country um it's not up to you the gender apartheid and the treatment of LGBT in every country besides Israel which would you be able to tell me what you yeah so um the gender aparte is is well it's actually it's not the correct uh use of the term but the uh um but
• 135:00 - 135:30 yeah women in Iran and Saudi Arabia um and and Gaza and in Gaza yes in Gaza they should have equ cor it's really not thank you you guys um they're going to shut down the lights on us if we don't wrap this up but I want to say something just in closing uh was there um I have a question for Mr ysf I'm right here I'm right over here on our way out where yeah wait who who's who's who's running the show I'm right here I don't know if you can see me but you're looking at me
• 135:30 - 136:00 right now so Mr ysf thank you so much for coming tonight and this question is directed towards you since October 7th I have noticed more and more people beginning to proudly walk around wearing the cafa specifically non-arab people and also people in queer spaces which I am a part of since I am queer myself how do you feel when you see queer people and University students specifically non-arab people people
• 136:00 - 136:30 wearing the kefia as a sort of as a sort of support and saying we support the Palestinian people how do you feel seeing that because personally I feel more and more scared walking around in America as a queer Iranian Jew and it really breaks my heart seeing this and I want to know what do you have to say to these people proudly walking around with the cfia not knowing the
• 136:30 - 137:00 significance thank you I I think you probably know his answer but go ahead um the only way I feel that I'm in the wrong business um because I could have sold millions of these cfas and became Rich out of the conflict so I've been missing out [Laughter] people can wear whatever they want to wear I don't have a problem with people wearing a CA uh people make dresses out
• 137:00 - 137:30 of it people might make some underwear out of it it's not my it's not my problem uh it will never make them uh authentic and uh they will never be part of the reality of the Middle East they will continue to be part of a virtual reality disconnected from The Real World and I guarantee you that this is not only his or their problems in life they
• 137:30 - 138:00 are disconnected from reality they are living in a alternative reality and this is where they think they rule by how many followers they have but eventually you know who decides the reality on the ground the brave soldiers who are fighting who are fighting the real fight in the face of the
• 138:00 - 138:30 monsters at the end of the day okay I agreed to come to this debate but I didn't think that is going to be this ridiculous but anyway I choose I choose to come to someone who's living in their own head and they want to defy a 45 year of solid experience that has the power of gravity that can take a Galaxy
• 138:30 - 139:00 in if necessary so he can go on thinking in his head at the end of the day the powerful soldiers those are my people those are the ones those are the ones who are going to decide the day and those are the ones who will write the history and everyone else will read it thank you guys I love you I love you and I'm
• 139:00 - 139:30 love you you I am sorry that this was very offensive wow what a situation wo that was sickening like literally sickening this guys Wow Let's sit somewhere where we don't we're not we not we're not totally exposed yet God bless you brother thank you have a good night hi hello okay can we please just go thanks
• 139:30 - 140:00 head to your drop off at Beverly Wilshire