Break the Cycle of Pornography Addiction | Ryan Soave & Dr. Andrew Huberman

Summary

In this engaging discussion, Ryan Soave and Dr. Andrew Huberman delve into the pervasive issue of pornography addiction, particularly among young men. They share the deep struggles individuals face, revealing how porn affects the brain similarly to substances like crack cocaine. The conversation explores the unrealistic perspectives porn creates around sex and intimacy, leading to anxiety and performance issues. The speakers emphasize the importance of acknowledging the problem, seeking help through therapy or 12-step programs, and reducing the shame associated with porn addiction to foster recovery.

Highlights

• Porn addiction creates unrealistic expectations, leading to relationship issues and performance anxiety in real life. 😣
• Access to pornography today makes it challenging for young men to seek real-world relationships. 🔍
• Therapy, accountability partners, and 12-step programs are effective tools for overcoming porn addiction. 💪
• Reducing shame and creating a supportive environment can help individuals feel less isolated. 🤗
• Understanding the biological and psychological effects is crucial in battling this addiction. 🧬

Key Takeaways

• Porn addiction affects the brain like crack cocaine, causing major challenges! 🧠
• Unrealistic expectations from porn can lead to relationship issues and performance anxiety! 😟
• Acknowledging the problem is the first step; seek help through therapy or support groups! 🚀
• Shame keeps people isolated; opening up is key to healing and overcoming addiction! 💬
• Community and awareness are crucial for recovery; you're not alone in this battle! 🤝

Overview

In today's digital age, pornography addiction is a rising concern, especially among young men, as highlighted by Ryan Soave and Dr. Andrew Huberman. They discuss how porn can mislead individuals by establishing unrealistic perceptions of sex and intimacy, setting them up for severe relationship and self-esteem issues. This addiction is likened to powerful substances like crack cocaine, showcasing its intense impact on the brain and behavior.

The duo emphasize the critical first steps towards recovery: recognition and seeking help. Many young men are reaching out, desperate to quit but unsure how. The speakers recommend therapy, 12-step programs, and accountability measures as effective ways to tackle this addiction, which often harbors an underlying layer of shame that can hinder recovery efforts.

Breaking the cycle of porn addiction involves fostering open discussions, reducing the associated stigma, and promoting awareness. Soave and Huberman stress the importance of community support and therapeutic intervention, encouraging individuals to connect with resources and people who can assist them in overcoming this prevalent issue.

Chapters

• 00:00 - 00:30: Introduction and Context Setting The chapter 'Introduction and Context Setting' opens with a discussion on the prevalence of porn addiction stories, predominantly shared by young men, although a few women have also been affected. The narrator reflects on the fortunate timing of their upbringing and suggests a possible lack of personal susceptibility to such addiction. The conversation is candid and introduces the issues surrounding modern challenges young men face.
• 00:30 - 01:30: Impact of Porn Addiction The chapter titled 'Impact of Porn Addiction' addresses the struggles of individuals who feel trapped by their compulsive consumption of pornography. The author shares experiences of people reaching out in desperation, asking for ways to quit their addiction. The chapter highlights the lack of enjoyment in the addictive behavior as individuals recognize the need to stop, yet struggle to break free. A study, albeit not detailed, is mentioned, indicating the historical concern around pornography addiction, particularly linked to video content. The chapter aims to shed light on the challenging journey of overcoming such an addiction and the need for effective intervention methods.
• 01:30 - 02:30: Psychological Effects of Porn Addiction The chapter discusses the psychological impacts of porn addiction, likening its effects to those of crack cocaine on the brain, particularly in young men. It highlights how pornography creates unrealistic perceptions of sex and intimacy.
• 02:30 - 04:00: Historical Perspective and Modern Challenges The chapter titled 'Historical Perspective and Modern Challenges' delves into the escalation of behaviors from seemingly normal activities to more extreme ones over time. It highlights how activities can evolve rapidly, potentially leading to personal and relational issues due to the feelings of shame associated with these behaviors. The chapter underscores how these changes, when unchecked, can influence individuals' lives and relationships adversely.
• 04:00 - 05:30: Accessibility and Addiction The chapter 'Accessibility and Addiction' explores the impact of pornography on sexual intimacy and performance anxiety. It highlights how younger generations are increasingly facing fewer intimate real-life scenarios, possibly due to the addictive nature of pornography. As individuals integrate pornography into their sexual experiences, particularly through fantasy and masturbation, it appears to rewiring their brain and nervous system. This rewiring can lead to sexual anxiety and performance issues when they engage in real-life sexual situations, as they have become accustomed to only observing sexual experiences rather than participating in them.
• 05:30 - 07:00: Approaches to Recovery The chapter titled 'Approaches to Recovery' explores the distinction between engaging directly in intimate sexual behavior and merely witnessing such behavior through pornography. The narrative appears to focus on the experiences of soldiers returning from Afghanistan or Iraq, marking a period (10-15 years ago) when internet access became prevalent. This context suggests a discussion on the psychological impacts of war and pornography consumption as part of broader themes around recovery.
• 07:00 - 08:30: Shame and Secrecy in Porn Addiction This chapter delves into the intertwining of sex and violence observed in the context of porn addiction. It discusses how exposure to both elements can create a sexual template for individuals where aggression and risk become integral to deriving pleasure from sex. Additionally, the chapter touches on the impact of unprecedented access to video pornography on individuals, influencing their sexual behaviors and perceptions.
• 08:30 - 10:00: Stigma and Need for Community Support The chapter discusses the challenges faced by military personnel in balancing their professional and personal lives, particularly after returning from active duty. This includes the difficulty of transitioning from a battlefield mindset to family engagements, such as discussing day-to-day events with a spouse. The chapter further explores the issue of porn addiction, highlighting its prevalence and the ease of access to pornographic content, which is exacerbated by social media platforms. These topics underline the stigma attached to such experiences and emphasize the necessity for robust community support mechanisms to aid individuals in coping with these challenges.

Break the Cycle of Pornography Addiction | Ryan Soave & Dr. Andrew Huberman Transcription

• 00:00 - 00:30 These days, I hear a ton of really um desperate stories, mostly from young guys. I've heard from maybe four or five women on this, but literally thousands of young men about porn addiction. Every time I hear about it, I feel so fortunate that I grew up in a time where or maybe I just don't have the the wiring for it. And if I did, I I would be I'm pretty open on this podcast. I I It's never been an issue for me. Um, and
• 00:30 - 01:00 they're telling me that they can't stop watching porn. I get the sense that they're not enjoying this experience anymore because they're reaching out to me saying, "How in the world can I quit?" And what do I tell them? I remember and again I don't know this study but I remember uh somebody referencing many years ago when I was first getting in the field that porn addiction at the time specifically related to um video
• 01:00 - 01:30 pornography which is what it all is now right um it was having the same impact on the brain and young men as crack cocaine I mean it's extremely powerful has a lot of other effects in that it sets up a very unrealist istic idea and perspective of what sex and intimacy is. You know, it also uh can help uh or can lead to kind of setting their sexual
• 01:30 - 02:00 template. You know, they can quickly escalate just like you would escalate. you kind of back to the the um uh hot fudge Sunday where it doesn't work anymore from you know something that might seem like normal sex to violent sex to really out there things that um can bring a lot of shame that they're even watching and it can escalate quickly and then have an impact on their own lives and relationships because
• 02:00 - 02:30 they're playing out those relationships or that amount of intimacy intimacy depending on what are doing also if there's masturbation along with it in in a fantasy. Well, what I'm also hearing is that anytime they are in a real life intimate scenario, which seems to be fewer and fewer times nowadays in the younger generation, that they're having sexual uh anxiety, sexual performance issues, which makes sense if they're if their brain and nervous system is getting wired by porn to observe sexual
• 02:30 - 03:00 behavior as opposed to being in the experience of of of intimate sex behavior, right? two different things to be in the experience versus watching someone else's experience of it which is what pornography is. Yeah. This was probably 10, 15 years ago where we were treating some but we treating a lot of soldiers that had come back from Afghanistan or Iraq and you know they had access this was like the first wars where they had access to the internet. I mean there's a lot of other
• 03:00 - 03:30 things. So there was a lot of uh kind of uh combining of sex and violence, right? they're around a lot of violence and then they're watching sex and then that kind of sexual template would set around like in order for them to get pleasure out of sex it would need to be aggressive or even even violent um or risk very risky you know so there's all these things that kind of collapse together there were other things going on was like the first time that they had also really had access to video uh uh
• 03:30 - 04:00 video chats to be able to like be on a battlefield and then come back and be talking to their spouse house about something that's going on with the kids. It was very confusing in environment for uh those guys and men and women. Um you know the the porn addiction is a is a tough one you know because it it's everywhere. I mean now you can find it on any social media almost not maybe not anyone but
• 04:00 - 04:30 it's not really limited you know and and even if it's not you know I know certain states have just put in where you have to put in your ID to get it but there's tons of ways around that and other sites that that people can go to and I've run into that with a lot of it does seem to be young men you know and it's a way for them to play out some sort of fantasy around connection and relationship and it's it makes their world really small.
• 04:30 - 05:00 I don't think it's the same as gambling, but it can make it it can make their world very very small in that they're instead of finding relationships out in the world. And it's not necessarily a relationship, but they're what they believe they're getting out of a relationship, they're then getting out of watching porn. It seems like basically stopping completely is the answer. And people say, and I'm not trying to moralize here, right? I'm not telling people what's moral about this. I just know that any behavior or substance that leads to quick repeated inflections in dopamine is going to
• 05:00 - 05:30 create a groove in the nervous system where you're going to crave that thing and it's going to give you a lower and lower sense of satisfaction over time. And the only way to reset that circuit is to stop and do something else in its place ideally that's adaptive. These are people that are asking you how they can stop. You know, they're telling you I can't stop. how do I do it? So, it can be similar to other addictions, you know, I mean, first the admission part
• 05:30 - 06:00 that it's a problem or awareness it is and then being able to start to to talk to somebody and start to take some accountability around it. Not accountability like you're doing something wrong, but to be able to have some sort of identify the behaviors that start leading to that. You know, I mean, there uh that can be done in therapy. There's other 12step groups that can help people with that to identify what their sobriety would look like, if you want to call it sobriety, what it looks like. And if it does involve not
• 06:00 - 06:30 watching any porn, then that's the rule set that they have. And then they figure out either with their therapist or in their treatment center or with their sponsor or community in 12step like how am I going to be held accountable to that? And that might be doing the things like we talked about laying out looking at your your day ahead at the beginning. They might need to look at things like, you know, uh there's ways and software out there to not be able to look at that on your phone or have an accountability partner that can, you know, you have to they have to approve websites you go to.
• 06:30 - 07:00 And and that that that's not to say that they have to do that forever, but it's something that's available, right? You know, 50 years ago or 30 years ago, someone had to like find their dad's porno mag somewhere and then look at it. You know, now it's on their phones or computers. Well, we know that accessibil increasing accessibility increases addiction, right? This has been studied over and over again. And people say, "What about red light districts and things?" And there's some caveats that have to do with when you uh create areas
• 07:00 - 07:30 within cities where certain things are allowed, but you know, this has been tested many, many times. Um it's also true, and it's kind of a duh, but to quote on it's impossible to get addicted to a substance or a behavior that you've never taken or engaged in, right? So, some things are best avoided entirely. Um, are there specific 12step programs for porn addiction that are separate from say sex addiction? If you people look it up, I'm sure there's meetings out there that that are specific to that. There are um some treatment centers that have tracks that deal specifically with that. There's
• 07:30 - 08:00 therapists that work very closely with that. And I I believe that there are some 12step I mean there's pretty much 12step programs for any sort of you know within things like SA or SLA there'll be subsets of meetings for people that are with a very specific condition. And one of the reasons I wanted to discuss this today is because I hear about it so much is unlike alcohol or drugs, there's a a kind of extra layer of shame associated with with pornography addiction for people. Um, you know, so many times
• 08:00 - 08:30 we've heard, oh, like this celebrity was a alcoholic or drug addict, you know, wrapped their car around a pole, was arrested, this and that, then they get sober and everyone still loves them loves them more, right? If we knew that a given celebrity was like a porn porn addict or something, we look at that person differently. Yeah. Especially if they're male, we just look at them differently. And so reducing some of the shame around it, I think, is key to to helping them recover because I can tell you there's the the questions initially came in kind of like as is often the
• 08:30 - 09:00 case with with men when they're trying to talk about issues that they were kind of cloaked in like what are your thoughts about nofap, which is this thing where guys um withhold ejaculation, okay? Does it increase testosterone? Turns out in the short run it does, in the long term it's probably not good for the prostate, etc. But then what it turned out they were really asking about masturbation. they were really asking about pornography and then all of a sudden I don't know what changed out there but there's been this deluge of of questions from young guys of how they can stop engaging in online
• 09:00 - 09:30 porn. A key to that is what you said about we look at them differently. You know, they're going to keep it secret, you know, and there's a saying secrets keep us sick, but I believe there's like a real almost a biology to that and that, you know, if you're holding it in, not sharing it, you know, there's no really place for it to go but shame. And shame separates us. And separate, we're not connected. And not connected, we're alone. And alone we're,
• 09:30 - 10:00 you know, we keep carrying that forward. Alone we're dead. You know, maybe not in that sense anymore like we talked about earlier, but like we're not really living. And so they're, you know, these guys are hearing you on a podcast and then DMing you, right? They're probably not in a personal close relationship with you, right? it's it's easier to send it there than maybe go ask for help with somebody in their area or go to a meeting or
• 10:00 - 10:30 something like that because of the the stigma. So, it's good that you've opened up the ability for people to do that, but to continue to direct them back to, you know, let's try to treat this like we would any other addiction at least from the standpoint of you've got to talk about it. You've got to have some sort of admission. You've got to be able to find a community around it. You want to be able to do work, you know, most likely with a therapist or a team of therapists that can help you understand what's driving that behavior. [Music]