Victoria-India Round Table - Day 1

Summary

Highlights

• Round table focused on educational collaborations between Victoria (Australia) and India 🌏
• Emphasized the development of research partnerships and joint degrees 🎓
• Highlighted the significance of student and staff mobility as a mutual growth opportunity ✈️
• Introduced 'scar' and 'tram' models to manage expectations effectively 🚦
• Explored challenges and strategies of employability, aligning with government agendas to fill skill gaps 👔

Key Takeaways

• Educational partnerships between Victoria, Australia, and India are poised to capitalize on shared ambitions and challenges.🌟
• There's a pressing need for bold solutions that address scale and employability in education.📏
• Research collaborations and student mobility provide pivotal platforms for mutual growth and innovation.🔗
• Expectation management remains crucial in sustaining long-term partnerships.📋
• Victoria's educational push includes aligning with India's National Education Policy to enhance bilateral ties.📘

Overview

Victoria-India Round Table - Day 1 Transcription

• 00:00 - 00:30 good afternoon everybody and apologies for being slightly late in starting this program but uh I think we're lucky we've got a big exhibition happening at the conference so people are still trying to find their way around and make it here uh in a couple of minutes I think in the next two three minutes we should have more people joining us but u a quick round of introductions before we start my name is adiya Gupta I head the India didactics Association and very happy to welcome all of you here at the D event uh where we are excited to see a big
• 00:30 - 01:00 Australian Victorian contingent a lot of e tech companies but more importantly all of you senior leadership teams from the Victorian universities and some of the best universities from around the world um I won't take too much time I think uh the more important point is that we should all know each other and uh try and see where we can forge collaborations Partnerships what Avenues of joining hands are possible and to set the context we've got I've got right here with me the honor John brambi AO
• 01:00 - 01:30 chair of Victoria's International Education advisory Council and Chancellor lro University and of course the former premier of Victoria thank you very much ad um we I think we will we'll do a very quick round the table just literally 10 seconds each uh on a very tough chair fantastic so so name and designation name name and organization organization thank you good afternoon R vice president
• 01:30 - 02:00 Eng good afternoon bruny nean Deputy Vice Chancellor external engagement swinburn University of Technology good afternoon colleagues David Israel director of global education strategy for the University of Melbourne
• 02:00 - 02:30 good afternoon uh this is Sheila ramchandran I'm Pro Chancellor of atmi University rajot Gujarat and an adviser to several other universities across India thank you good afternoon I'm Dr bries n I'm the director of the vat Bangalore campus thank you uh good afternoon I'm sudhir Kumar Bari director of bits filani filani campus and also the the academic director for bits RM higher education Academy good afternoon our Dr Pradip Kumar Pro man University fad Del
• 02:30 - 03:00 NCR good afternoon everyone I'm Professor nurhan Vice Chancellor of University of Kashmir Jammu and Kashmir good afternoon Dr Sunil Ry Chancellor UPS University of Tomorrow deun Namaste I'm rajita Kar I'm the president of Shri University and I'm also an elected member on the court of Indian Institute of science
• 03:00 - 03:30 hello I'm Craig Jeffrey I'm Deputy Vice Chancellor at Monash University Duncan Bentley vice president of sorry Vice Chancellor and president of federation University Australia the trouble with too many titles is that you get after four and a half hour time difference you get tangled up excent Sally curtain I'm the chief executive of Bendigo Kang Institute I'm representing Victoria's tapes today um hi everyone Professor Theo farell I'm Vice Chancellor and president of latro UN University good afternoon uh
• 03:30 - 04:00 Professor wenat RNA Vice chairman of the state Council of Higher Education government of telengana also the vice Chancellor of Rajiv Gandhi University Technical University in Telangana good afternoon everyone I'm Priya raat I'm vice president and the head of the education sector of invest India the national investment promotion agency under the ministry of Commerce and Industry government of India good afternoon my name is Mahesh Sharma I am with India director
• 04:00 - 04:30 like I said I'm adya and I think together mahes sir and I will be taking the responsibility of trying to make sure that we are sticking to time and we're able to talk about all the six topics which we have lined up for you but we have a good time telling professors it's time yeah that's fun um thank you very much and can I just say um I'm delighted that we've got such a distinguished group here today uh adicha and mesh are going to run the six
• 04:30 - 05:00 sessions that we've got and we're going to try to keep on time and then my job at the end will be to try and summarize that all uh succinctly and take away uh the learnings from the discussion that we've got uh I see that we're in the wisdom room so uh I'm sure that there'll be great wisdom that's generated uh through our discussions today uh I did want to say a few words uh too about the uh Victorian delegation that's uh in India this week we've obviously been running in parallel with the premier's
• 05:00 - 05:30 delegation and you may have seen the premier in the um stage earlier this morning at the conference uh so we're uh four days here in uh Delhi and then our delegation is going on to Bango for a day and a half there so it's a fantastic program uh we've had great meetings to date uh including um participation in this conference today so I'm really looking forward to uh this discussion today
• 05:30 - 06:00 um as adicha said I apart from being Chancellor of lrob University I also chair the Victorian government's International Education advisory Council uh our role is to promote International Education to promote dialogue to promote Partnerships uh and we are 110% supportive of International Education transnational education and of course Indian students who choose to study in Melbourne uh we we've got worldclass
• 06:00 - 06:30 institutions in Melbourne we uh rank as the world's most uh as Australia's most popular city amongst International students we rank fifth in the world and of course uh we are home to around 40% four out of every 10 Indian students who study in Australia choose to study in Victoria and we're really proud of that fact and in turn um Indian students make up 23% % they're the biggest single
• 06:30 - 07:00 group of all International students who study in our state so pretty much one in every four International students that study in Victoria um come from India we have a very long-standing relationship as we'll hear today some of our universities have Partnerships in India going back uh to 1990 and so we see this uh as a really opportune time uh as a perfect time really to build and strengthen the Rel relationship between Victoria and
• 07:00 - 07:30 Australia and India and there's no better place to do that than around uh education and particularly higher education uh yesterday at the opening of uh Melbourne University's new campus the Australian High Commissioner to India Philip green spoke and he said that having been involved in the Australia India relationship all of his life um he'd seen it grow and mature and it had always been a very positive relationship and a longstanding relationship but he's
• 07:30 - 08:00 never seen the relationship as good as it is at this point in time and in Victoria we share that view we share it particularly from an education perspective and what we're interested in in this delegation uh and this visit is how we uh build and expand on the great opportunities between our two countries um if I just go to the TNA opportunities if I might uh We've now got more than
• 08:00 - 08:30 200 uh academic and research collaborations between uh Victorian and Indian institutions and a number of collaborations have been announced uh this week including one last night by latro University um under our research Partnerships um and under the relationship more generally uh education providers have facilitated uh student exchanges they've developed joint degree
• 08:30 - 09:00 programs U they've fostered long-term research collaboration and as well have delivered skills training uh in India and we believe that there are further opportunities uh including increasing two-way student and academic Mobility extending research collaborations and strengthening of course the alumni uh engagement uh we believe that India's education sector I think we've uh spent a lot of time studying the National
• 09:00 - 09:30 Education plan we've spent a lot of time in discussions in our meetings this week in relation to the National Education plan and certainly education in India is on very much of an upward trajectory and it presents enormous opportunities for Partnerships for collaborations for Innovation and for exchange and uh I'm advised that there are currently around 45,000 colleges uh a thousand plus
• 09:30 - 10:00 universities and 1500 institutes in India uh I mentioned the National Education policy we had some excellent discussions about that with the uh grants uh commission yesterday uh but under that plan as I understand it the aspiration to achieve a 50% Target by 2035 means that between now and 2035 there will be something like 30 million additional uh uh Indians who will be
• 10:00 - 10:30 participating in vocational education and training or in higher education and that's in rough terms it's around three million a year and that's just the growth in the system let alone what's happening in the base and so we see this in Victoria again as a huge opportunity um to build on the long-standing relationships and the history the very positive history that we already have um with uh with India I mentioned uh recent announcements last
• 10:30 - 11:00 night as I said our vice Chancellor with the Victorian Premier announced the uh LR University partnership with the Bangalore bioinnovation Center and we're uh traveling to Bangalore tomorrow morning uh and uh I've been to Bangalore on a couple of previous occasions and it's certainly a center of uh great Innovation and uh great research but I'm proud to say too sitting to my right rev representing Deacon University deacon University have established uh they're
• 11:00 - 11:30 the first foreign University anywhere in the world to establish their campus here in India and so full credit to Deacon University our hats go off for the leadership that they've shown in response uh to this great opportunity that's been created uh by the Indian government and I think if we had a vision uh we'd like to see from the Victorian perspective we'd like to see more Victorian universities or even consorti of Victorian universities again establishing here and really opening up
• 11:30 - 12:00 these opportunities you know for partnership for exchange for research and helping to meet those ambitious targets under the National Education plan so um today we've got just two hours uh to consider the the outlook for transnational education Partnerships between Victorian and Indian universities and that is the focus um I should say too last night the Victorian
• 12:00 - 12:30 Premier um who's here all week and I must say Victorian Premier Premier are busy people the first overseas visit that our Premier has had and she's chosen India right and it's significant that she's chosen India by the way back in 2009 yes thank you back in 2009 I know a long time ago 15 years ago I was the then Premier and the now Premier was the minister for industry and trade and she accompanied me to India and she stayed here 10 days
• 12:30 - 13:00 because I asked her to as the premier to build the relationships with India and she traveled right across India and built those relationships and I think it's such a positive sign uh that she's back again for her first formal visit so today we've got the six sessions uh the time frame is tight is 15 minutes per session uh so it's a tight time frame and we do want to leave plenty of time for questions and comments and discussions and really the goal is to extract lessons to identify inovative approaches to anticipate any bottlenecks
• 13:00 - 13:30 they are always bottlenecks right the best my experience in life you can have the best policy in world in the world there are always challenges in implementation so thinking about the potential and mainly what we want out of today is clear actionable Pathways and I shouldn't say just finally on that the premier announced a Victorian initiative $5 million Victorian which is what how many rupia 3 three three million is it
• 13:30 - 14:00 how many anyway 30 million 300 million there's no mathematicians we need more stem around the table uh but a significant inrent to support transnational education and I can tell you the number one focus of that will be in country in India right I can tell you that I can guarantee it so um that's all from me today I'm going to hand over to uh adicha and mesh who are going to run this and then my job at end we'll be it
• 14:00 - 14:30 try and summarize and bring that all together thank you so much sir and pretty much on Q on timelines so well set and um like you said it's a wisdom room and we've got a lot of wisdom and leadership in this room and uh this is about collaboration and it's great to hear the kind of initiative which Victoria is taking looking at India as the big partner and I think India is all set to become the big partner uh for a lot of collaborations which are possible and that's why we've got some of the best universities the most Progressive mindsets who are here to actually look
• 14:30 - 15:00 at these kind of collaborations just want to go back quick second because we've got a couple of our guests who just joined us 5 Seconds name designation and universities which you are representing so that we can continue the conversations if you can just tell us your name University and designation for the whole group to know thank you I am Dr sandep chhat I'm the pro Vice Chancellor at Dy par International University Pune okay and earlier I had the pleasure to work with I kak my old colleague profess is here Delhi
• 15:00 - 15:30 and jaal University perfect welcome sir yeah myself uh love krishu representing Andra Pradesh Member of Parliament yes so good to see all of you here thank you fantastic okay um like uh John said we've got six topics which we are going to cover and the way we're going to have this conversation is we will be looking
• 15:30 - 16:00 at the topic and we will invite one of our Victorian Partners to set the context give us a little bit about what they think about the topic how a particular collaboration is possible what do the think about it and then we will invite one or two Indian leaders to respond to that and look at various methodologies so we're trying to basically pack a lot of topics in this small time frame and that's that's the format which we'll follow the first topic which we would want to touch upon today is research collaborations or joint degrees what is
• 16:00 - 16:30 the optimal starting point and craigus is initiating it yes yeah so Professor Craig will initiate from the Victorian side we have just one request if we could be as brief as possible and that's an impossibility for a professor but still
• 16:30 - 17:00 but today I'm here mainly as that's a round of applause that deserves you know the interesting thing about India is that some of us don't understand Hindi such s right I will now I will carry on in
• 17:00 - 17:30 English and I'm sorry this is a great start because we needed to lighten up but I have to play the spoil Sport and may maintain time so I'll say let's let's get on so my question was the uh research collaboration or joint degrees what is the optimal strategy and the way I've interpreted that question is to think about what are the key considerations in building educational Partnerships across the Australia India boundary and I want to come up with three T's before I mention those three TS I just want to give you a little bit
• 17:30 - 18:00 of context if you'll give me permission Monash university has a network of global campuses and presences we have a university in Malaysia which has 10,000 students we have a joint graduate school in China we have a a new campus in Indonesia we have a research facility in in Italy and importantly we also have a uh joint PhD Academy with iitb in Mumbai which was established in 2008 and which has seen 250 PhD researchers graduate we
• 18:00 - 18:30 have a current cohort of 175 so the three TS is really I think some Reflections on both that experience of building a Global Network but also more specifically that experience of working with India around that joint graduate school and and thinking about also some of the research collaborations t& Partnerships that we've built here and the 3ts are simply this and this I think will be familiar to many in the room but I thought it would be useful as a provocation to start the first is time
• 18:30 - 19:00 and when I saw this title I thought well joint degrees are all very well but often actually what you need is a very long-term approach that builds slowly to Joint degrees so one starts by getting academics to do joint supervision one then builds some institutional infrastructure around that and the outcome might be the joint degree but time commitment over the long term focusing on relationships rather than ribbon cutting I think is absolutely essential in building these Partnerships the second T is teamwork and in particular wanted to point to the importance in these building these
• 19:00 - 19:30 relationships of having senior level buyin but with the greatest respect to people around this table sometimes those senior figures cycle through fairly quickly what you need is the academic staff and the professional staff who are in it for the long haul to be fully engaged with the the relationship to be Champions and ambassadors for that relationship and to be uh able to to go back to the first point see that through in the long term so that faculty interest I think is absolutely critical and the third T which should be obvious
• 19:30 - 20:00 but I wanted to underline it at the start was that it should be a two-way relationship it should be very clear how this is a reciprocal is of reciprocal Mutual benefit to both parties sitting coming here from Australia to India I believe that that Talent is evenly distributed across the world which means if you've got a population of nearly 1.5 billion a lot of the world's Talent is is here in terms of Staff in terms of students in terms of perspective students so one of the key uh elements for Australia is actually being able to be involved D with that talent pool but
• 20:00 - 20:30 also to find ways to build uh research impact which is another area where I think India is is really critical but there has to be constant reflection on how that that relationship is two-way and and there needs to be underpinning that a great deal of respect on both sides of both institutions so perhaps obvious but I thought important to set out as a first step in in this first topic thanks wonderful and what's interesting here is that Professor CRA I'm pronouncing you right sir C cig huh yeah that that'll do
• 20:30 - 21:00 yeah yeah that's great uh the most important thing is that you you started off with uh time and and probably uh an interesting observation here is that let's start with with with interactions of Faculty first and let that end in a join degree rather than a joint degree as a starting point and that's an interesting uh point to look at uh before we intervene let's have wna respond to it uh I think U we also believe especially in
• 21:00 - 21:30 the state of Telangana we have been trying to adopt this given the ecosystem we have found that basically a lot of research institutions are there also 17 universities in the state but what we have found is there are different ages of this University some are 100 year old some are 50 and some have long-standing relationships so our strategy is now to consolidate on those long-standing relationships build up new Partnerships and look at new areas of research so I
• 21:30 - 22:00 we also feel that it's time for join degrees dual degrees winning programs but we are not yet ready because we want to have a personto person interaction being a faculty myself I realized that unless you have a Dean to Dean or a professor to professorial kind of and then exchange visit student immersion then the real interest starts otherwise rightly said some policy maker sitting here or sitting somewhere cannot drive these initiatives it has to come it's not a top down it's kind of a teamwork
• 22:00 - 22:30 and I fully appreciate and we are Keen to have these Partnerships and work on this along with other you one one question to the the group here is also that is it always like that that should all Partnerships start with the faculty faculty interaction or is it also possible that we start with a joint program I've done joint programs about 20 years back when I was working with am we started off as a joint program the problem was that my my two-year program was valued at one and a half years and
• 22:30 - 23:00 then University of C lingon took that and gave a six months uh Capstone and gave a degree so is that the way or probably starting on a faculty to faculty basis is a better way just one second you know I don't mean that uh the the the grand way of launching projects is not right for example in this wisdom room we could come out with 10 ideas and five of of them can materialize and then starts the process we need to work out on the uh other Arrangements I think that's what I can say while the ongoing
• 23:00 - 23:30 things can go there could be grand plans and projects for the universities which can be launched and then care should be taken that all these go through in the in the kind of sop so to speak uh in launching this projects research comes collaboration come before joint Mr C would you respond to that would you like to I was just thinking about that you know saying that that you know I am an academic but you know that that that organizing academics is like hurting cats but you know the response to that
• 23:30 - 24:00 is you know if you've got a bowl of cream all the cats will come to the cream and there's multiple ways of thinking about how joint agreements can start and one might be because a donor or government or or a corporation says you know we would like to fund an agreement between two universities or between a two two in a Consortium and and in that context it can be possible to Galvanize academic and professional staff quite quickly because there is a very clear resource yeah resource and and you can step out of program so I think it it it depends I was thinking
• 24:00 - 24:30 much more of you know and so you know it ties in with your point if you're trying to develop something organically you need Champions who are going to be working on this on on an everyday basis otherwise it becomes you know 3% of my time and 3% of your time and and it's it's difficult you're running it off the edge of your desk yes we we'll definitely take three minutes on this because that's the time we have yeah I just want to say something which has just started off Real Time with the Victorian Universities at GIF
• 24:30 - 25:00 City in Gujarat with research as well as joint degrees the Deacon University and two other universities with the government of Gujarat have signed anou and they've set up campus there mainly for research on three topics one is on Logistics the second one is about how we future proof the infrastructure which is going to be built for the Olympics in future so that it could be used for something else and the third topic so you know this is how research and
• 25:00 - 25:30 universities are uh joining up but whether it should lead to a joint degree program or should it be immersions of Faculty members as well as students for one semester abroad to understand what is actually happened there in that research field then come back and then you know try to do and how can we extrapolate it Beyond Gujarat this is yet another aspect I just wanted to share this with you please because you did mention Deon we will want to have one input because the way yeah no I
• 25:30 - 26:00 absolutely and I think that our experience in GI City and Deacon University uh and with the Gujarat government and the ecosystem is absolutely uh you know really building um ground up and top down as well I think that uh transnational research uh ability to make uh adaptation and changes has been really really exciting there is a fintech Institute that is being set up uh by GI city which again is looking at at the three pillars which is education Skilling and research and
• 26:00 - 26:30 being part of that ecosystem within gift City with 600 organizations operating has been very exciting that doils with what Professor Craig said in terms of somebody providing the initial funding and then ganizing people around a particular theme yeah so so we're basically saying that it could be top down or bottom up depending on the funding and the resources yes so if there is funding we're looking at top down and if there is no resources we looking at Bottoms Up that's an interesting way of putting it yeah I
• 26:30 - 27:00 mean we have one observation yes yeah just rather on the uh focused on the research part of it my suggestion here is that we go on the joint research and that to Let's identify the so I'm a commissar of Applied research more than the fundamental research we are at a fast pace of development I come from utarak there are topics of climatology clean energy drone own where government of India government of utarak so if
• 27:00 - 27:30 there is a Synergy between the research that will help the society here and now so it's a joint research which I am proposing where the governments the institutions will rise in that all issues of funding as well as we will see the results of that research coming so I am proposing a joint research on selected themes which are affecting the society here and now in whichever the local region that is yeah so as we see these points and
• 27:30 - 28:00 just to summarize this discussion uh more uh we hear is that research could be a good starting point when we say what is the optimal Point joint degrees can happen but it all depends on the kind of Partnerships and the kind of resources which are being put in but otherwise research could be the ideal starting point could be joint research or could be specific area research yes ma'am quick last comment you know actually uh uh very brief actually we have a Center of Excellence that's Himalayan and glacial studies we are
• 28:00 - 28:30 already we have joint collaboration with some of the scientists of Australia recently they had come for around 15 days trip we took them to ladak they had to collect some data from there so I think we need to collect data from other universities also if such collaborations are going on anywhere and strengthen them first what base is already there just strengthen it because uh you know climatic change studies in jnk would be
• 28:30 - 29:00 really good for at Global level and and University of Kashmir must first collaborate we we are doing we doing we are already doing we we doing it with Northeast and all the Himalayan region no absolutely so so I think we're all endorsing the fact that it'll start all start with joint research and that could be an optimal starting point was the question and then joint degrees will happen case to case based on uh where we see the resources being put in fantastic it's been a I have time quite quite odd
• 29:00 - 29:30 for a group of professors we've got fantastic people working fantastic chair there yes so the the next topic we definitely want to have views on is student and staff Mobility is it a low hanging fruit because we started the context setting bit saying lot of victoriia Indian students go to Victoria they're one of the largest cohorts which are there so is student and staff Mobility the lwh hanging fruit and there we should have
• 29:30 - 30:00 be to Kickstart because you've set up a campus and you've got students going there directly as well yes um just before I talk about this I just want to say I can validate the previous discussion because we've seen over our 30-year Journey that starting out with the research collaboration has really helped and then building joint degrees which we have and then you know ensuring student mobility and staff Mobility which also is a very important part so I think that journey I can validate that over the years has been absolutely very
• 30:00 - 30:30 has it been the case with IB mes very much so yes yeah very much to um coming on to the point about um I think uh student and staff Mobility my first question to ourselves is let's think about in today's world and age what is it that the students and staff actually want and when you start thinking about that you start thinking about what is it in the internationalization phase that organizations institutions and governments need to think about and I
• 30:30 - 31:00 think it is about policies I think it is about ecosystem I think it is about infrastructure I think it is about the costing and I also think it is about the model um I believe that the internationalization does not sit on top of things I think internationalization needs to be organically in the organization and that everything around that needs to be part of the um internationalization so student intern nationalization staff internationalization curriculum
• 31:00 - 31:30 internationalization once we embed that as an institution then student and staff Mobility becomes a normal part of business as usual for us and at dickon University we've seen that happen over the years and which is how we have been able to establish some very strong Partnerships having a campus here also I think has really made it interesting because we have recruited the very first batch of our students and that's very exciting and the first thing that they asked us was is there a chance to spend some time time in Deacon University and I think that that does come to the point
• 31:30 - 32:00 about what can we as universities and governments do to make sure that that becomes easy so I think the NEP has really made it possible because you know credits can be crossed we can actually work together now um so um I do think that from the Australian Indian framework mapping it has been very useful uh but I'm interested in the thoughts of um I think my colleague is also going to be speaking about this point just one point I'd like to make can we think about uh models of
• 32:00 - 32:30 Engagement with staff and student how do we ensure that it can be hybrid so it is ongoing and it is not like you travel and then you come back and you finish uh so Hybrid models of um staff and student engagement and I think incentives on both sides uh I think that'll that's where I'd like to hear some thoughts about and then one small addition to that costing costing yes can can we make it cost neutral yes on both sides considering the exchange rates we have
• 32:30 - 33:00 yeah is it possible to make it cost we have Professor yeah we have yes bronty yes bronty from from swinburn um I I speak from a very personal experience of of student Mobility having participated in my first Exchange in a as a high school student and then spending six months um of my masters as a study abroad student and I absolutely concur with rev n's points around um within the framework of of policy and development
• 33:00 - 33:30 but I also bring it down to that very personal level of um our borders uh you know we can transgress borders more and more easily now that understanding the different viewpoints and that value of immersion I think to um enhance our relationships is really important when um when I look at swinburn and the opportunities that that we provide for students um we look at the student and staff
• 33:30 - 34:00 Mobility but also um swinburn has has four Moon shots um one of those is that every student receives a work um integrated learning experience and that every student either graduates with a job or creates a job so within our our student Mobility we are also very much focused on the ability for internships we look at internships abroad both physical um and certainly one of the the positives of Co if you can think of it in that way was then we were forced to actually explore virtual internships
• 34:00 - 34:30 they have continued on these days and it's not just around the student having a placement with a company overseas we also try and build in some of those cultural interactions and engagement with broader communities for those students that abroad that brings opportunities around access and Equity uh for students that can't afford to to physically travel Who maybe for physical reasons are unable to travel but it also has has benefits in terms of sustainability and so when we look at
• 34:30 - 35:00 the the footprint of all of our movement um there are some benefits when we explore the other opportunities I do think when I reflect on Australia um our Mobility is not at the level that we would like we don't tend to We tend to when I look at our student cohort and I've worked at a number of universities you know travel to and and study abroad options are you know the us or or North America Europe UK Australians are not that adventurous
• 35:00 - 35:30 in terms of traveling into into Asia or or countries that they've not um being immersed in and I think that is where the opportunities around the government funding of new Columbo plan is really important um to create those different opportunities and I would also hope through the um the yes to International Education fund when we look at our transnational education um presence that we can have that Mobility to those campuses unfortunately um some of the other Government funding doesn't allow that but that's when we
• 35:30 - 36:00 look at our International campuses we want to send some of our students to those delivery locations yeah just one another point I'd like to make is that um I think that's uh absolutely well said um ronti I think um in terms of ensuring that there is a credit available at the end of it for the students because what what other than uh getting the cultural intelligence what is it that they're going to be looking at so if the Frameworks can be mapped and we can give credit into each other's institutions we do think that the
• 36:00 - 36:30 movement will be more between the students I think we've already sir wna could also respond to this uh that's later yeah but we have we have that we have a national skills qualification framework which at least on paper must have mapped everything by 2019 but considering that we are diverse country we will be there by about 25 but we'll be there we'll be there we'll be there for sure so the very well said and I think very candid points came out on that that you know honest conversations that credits are important it's not just
• 36:30 - 37:00 the cultural exchanges and the experiences um I like to bring Mr Lau in because two reasons of course he's a member of parliament Member of Parliament leading the education group but also an Alum from Victoria so we talking about student staff Mobility so is that the right way to look at the partnership I think we we to start with the student Mobility that's what um I think we should focus on um the point that uh uh uh he has has made doctor has made
• 37:00 - 37:30 with regards to we are you know the whenever any University approaches any University come forward the only thing they ask for is a twinning program in a ug level or that's where it start and mostly it will end it's so boring for us to be very Frank uh because we all know that eventually you want students uh but what is it that as a country as a university I'm getting it that's what I look at at it uh any other university will look at it obviously you also look
• 37:30 - 38:00 at it so what we look for is anything that can be added at the at the doctoral level PhD level uh where there can be some student Mobility that H that can happen that can be initiated uh you know for uh for for a student from India to go and study his pursue his PhD fully in other country it's very costly and you know there how we can make it much more convenient and much more affordable for them if you can start there uh you know
• 38:00 - 38:30 even the PhD students from there if they can come here and spend some time here maybe spend a semester here in the universities here I think mes is doing it with I Bombay uh you know if they can do it with other other universities also one more so why I say PhD level is that will be much more you know deeper connection that will happen once
• 38:30 - 39:00 you start doing a not just the study but also the research level so it has to happen both this and I have seen it because I did my undergrad at [Laughter] elro so experience both the countries so I think that's the way we should go forward but since we have the opportunity we should also maybe spent a minute or two on looking at what could India offer uh to to an potential IAL Australian student uh uh what could we
• 39:00 - 39:30 offer as as a country that's exactly what he was talking that because credit is one thing which we will work at I think uh already the NEP mandates that 40% of the credit is transferable whether online or offline so that shouldn't be a problem but in addition to that what else can the country offer which would make it attractive for a potential Australian student I think yeah okay oh just wanted to interv sir please okay uh so in India uh the
• 39:30 - 40:00 biggest strength uh in terms of both quality and numbers is undergraduate students in higher education so if somehow we can start early training students uh collaborating between Australian University and University at under level as early as third semester so we can start with some online course online module which faculty from Australia can teach our students so there will be some kind of handholding once the interest is generated then student can go for one semester two semester and we can talk about the Dual degree joint degree or twin degree so
• 40:00 - 40:30 that will be initial point where practically at very low cost it can start and we can see the number of student going abroad for these kind of programs okay can I can I add one point I yeah yeah I'm Ram gopal ra I'm sorry I got a little bit delayed I think what India can offer is a very good question one thing India can offer is entry for the startups right India has huge markets for any technology India can provide the scale and uh so these PhD
• 40:30 - 41:00 research and all of that becoming startups I think uh if India can be partners in those PHD programs you have access to a billion people to Market your ideas I think that's one thing and the second thing which India can offer is very lowcost way of doing research right I mean the PHD student we have a very good tie up now with rmit earlier I was at I Delhi we started the University of Queensland I Delhi thing I was also part of the manach progam program now for Australia there is everything to
• 41:00 - 41:30 gain right for for supporting a PhD student for one year in Australia you actually getting a PhD student for four years and the student is and the faculty members are involved from the beginning in the research activity all research papers are jointly co-authored so for one year of investment you're actually getting four years of returns so I think the startups and the and the scalable way of you know doing PHD programs I think Australia has everything to get out of this program just one point uh
• 41:30 - 42:00 can I add just on this just one point that basically what he said was about that two-way I'm running three relationships one is with Australia University of Queensland New South Wales we running with France and we're also running with Canada of these the program which is working very well is with France uh though we have last two years so we have the progression arrangements with these two and where the we I personally find that it is happening is
• 42:00 - 42:30 that French students are there on my campus and therefore my students see that they are seeing a value so unless otherwise the students from Victoria you know it it may not be a full term it could be a halterm it could be for cricket matches or whatever you know so if if they come here then that exchange will be much better is what I am saying so unless it's two-way as you said we see value in you do see value in US yeah I think that's a really good
• 42:30 - 43:00 point can I suggest you know if uh we could actually have um a further discussion on this and come up with some points and circulate some thoughts across so we can get some outcomes in terms of possibilities and models of Engagement that will work yeah we could we could absolutely and I think that's one of the thing we would want to do after this that we jot down this because the more we he we are saying it is has to be two-way I mean he say he said the context with those 3ts that it is two-way and it is about students coming into India as well and showcasing that
• 43:00 - 43:30 it's not just a student and staff Mobility one way it could be two ways so like I said PhD students or exchange students but that has to be a two-way collaboration and and Professor ra made a valid point cost and scale cost and scale he only speak in millions in this country anything less than a million doesn't matter to us so yeah that that's a that's a good one for us but uh you're absolutely right I think U uh this is a topic which of course after this we will come out with pointers share it with all of us in the this room do we have a minute for Professor Craig I we do U no
• 43:30 - 44:00 I just want to finish this point yeah that we will come out with the pointers and we will share with all of you so that you can add where we are missing and then you're right that outcomes will come because this is actually in this short time of two topics and five minutes we're saying really concrete points that somebody who's been an Alum is seeing it and somebody who's run programs is actually saying what has worked and what has not in different countries the one point to what r Ed on the mobility part is linking it to visas
• 44:00 - 44:30 work visas again we have a relationship with a business school in France and the reason it is working is because it is linked to fiveyear work Visas so when you connect it to a sustainable work visa uh linkage after the program that gives you a sort of strength to the mobility which otherwise would have other just been like a term or three months in and out so work visas is important and I wanted to add to Dr R's point of scale um uh is also the
• 44:30 - 45:00 complexity and the diversity like recently there was a delegation which was you know from Singapore and they said the kind of medical challenges that you are experiencing here we don't even see those there so the diversity even of the problems we we experience here are uh you know I think uh worth uh for uh for other countries to come and learn so you know turn it around so I think the diversity the scale and uh the really strong ecosystem of startups that is
• 45:00 - 45:30 getting uh I think uh created in India I think we are in numbers we may be third but in terms of again the the vibrancy of it I think we could really be number one in the world so absolutely I think that's something to offer yeah for sure I mean like I said I think there is that absolute thing um it's just that we have to cover few more topics so I am going a little fast but as I see it two-way has to be the Q case it has not one way and um we did have uh our professor Bron say
• 45:30 - 46:00 talking about internships and connecting it with industry experience so I think work visa has become a very important part of it as well so just can I just add one point so uh with v uh Deacon has got a very long relation and we have every year in V8 chenai around 20 students from Deacon coming so they spend two weeks so one week in the campus and one week they go to the industry so very similar to what you told about the medical conditions like they have got new challenges in the
• 46:00 - 46:30 industry so we have been running this successfully for the last few years where the students come from Deacon and spend that's a great validation of the point which was being discussed I think a working and this can be a first step to the previous discussion of research collaboration this can lead to the faculty to faculty level collaboration and all those things so the student staff Mobility both this is possible with a long-standing relationship thank you research is why the faculty all agree yeah all faculty faes agree on research the minute we use that word
• 46:30 - 47:00 okay the the third topic we want to touch upon today is collaborative degrees which I think we've kind of talking yes and there is also one issue of we will slightly go a little deeper onto delivery and challenges because that's where the challenge actually lies in terms of sustaining it over a period of time I was cooled at day new we probably University and uh had 63 Tis the last I know not more than four
• 47:00 - 47:30 work so thean University is the first Port of Call for most universities when they come to but very few work uh so yes there is a huge challenge to run it over a period of time and we have Professor Leon Leon Pike from AR yeah so you responding might
• 47:30 - 48:00 wow to actually give the bit perspective and then I'll come back to the rmit perspectives I'll give W so we have the bits professors representing both bits and rmit that's good that shows the depth of our relationship collaborative degrees challenges and opportunities so we talking about collaboration the VM thing is definitely taken off I mean just two years now we have 224 undergraduate students 62 PhD students we just you know are not even
• 48:00 - 48:30 finished two years now so it's already touching 300 students kind of a thing and the reason why I think it's happening is there is a win-win for both the sites for bits Pani what is that we see out of this partnership we want to strengthen our PHD programs I mean undergraduate we get 200,000 applications we just take about 3,500 students joining hands with rmit wouldn't add anything to us so undergraduate thing is there because it provides a sustainable financial model these are all fee paying students
• 48:30 - 49:00 tuition fee paying students now in the bits rmit Academy which is what we have created now there is a financial model you earn money from one program you spend money on the other program which is the PHD program so whereas you know in I Delhi or I Bombay there is no sustainable model you know who will support the PhD students if you want to grow to 500 students I think it's going to be very expensive for both IAT as well as the foreign Partners but in a private Institution like bits where we have the autonomy to even join hands at
• 49:00 - 49:30 the undergraduate level it provides a sustainable model in the academy kind of thing so that is one thing which is very useful for us and so it it will eventually become cost neutral so and uh and the important thing is the the PHD programs now the kind of students we are able to attract to bits because of the rmit collaboration we wouldn't have got them otherwise they would have either gone to iats or most most of them would have actually gone abroad right they wouldn't have come to bits so now because of this
• 49:30 - 50:00 collaboration because of the joint degree the degree that they are receiving from rmit we are getting some very high quality applications you know and and that to me is the most important aspect of the bits AR collaboration the undergraduate St both both join sign by both signed by both the so that is the wonderful thing and also even from the rankings point of view now we have done enough studies now in the bit system any place where we have an international collaborator on a
• 50:00 - 50:30 paper the papers get a 2X citations the papers are cited two times more right so therefore now you are saving money because one year of Fellowship is born by rmit right you are getting very high quality students your papers are getting cited two times more and you have access to facilities at both the sites right so therefore that is the kind of a thing we are looking forward to so for us in including the undergraduate program is to provide that financial model so we
• 50:30 - 51:00 can scale up the PHD program I would like to see at least 500 PhD students between bits and rmit in the next four to 5 years that's a kind of a scale that we are looking for which we would not have been able to do otherwise before we proceed further I just have one request which is that is there a research collaboration possibility at the undergraduate level yeah because PhD is something every Professor speaks about it comes naturally to an AC so may I just come in
• 51:00 - 51:30 here actually I yeah so no so I'll just very quickly because I'm talking from the rmit point of view and I'll take up your point as well so what Professor ra mentioned is that under bits rmit higher education Academy we have a two programs it's undergraduate program 2 plus two and we have a PhD program under that we have the multi- departmental programs now in this 2 plus2 program it's a very interesting this program has taken up because of co-designed co-curated co- delivered and this is a very critical
• 51:30 - 52:00 part of it so the day one the RIT faculty member is engaged with the student with when the student is in B spani so this is something which is there the faculty member remotely offers he comes physically also spends times into the campus and delivers it so I think that's one part is very important the immersion at International level for the student is very very essential so they should have that sense of belongingness and any program of International level has to be within multiple words which I use trust respect
• 52:00 - 52:30 for each other understanding each other's problem and coming down to a problem solving so that we do not have a hindrance any place so this is something and affordability is of course what you have been always highlighting now coming to the undergraduate program 2 plus2 and research part of it B has been always on a Forefront on WE entrepreneurs Factory in the desert so we have developed the Innovation culture and startup culture among the students so we have built the tunnel between the bits and rmit through our technology business incubator with
• 52:30 - 53:00 the technology business incubator at rmit through which the student from day one would have an engagement so that when he goes after two years over there he continues doing the research and maybe end up doing the startup and that is what actually the research part is also there so there are multi uh level at multiple uh ways we are keeping our engagement so much on so that it helps actually so be the faculty Mobility our faculty members goes students have traveled for immersion program that is the most most important part that 95 students in a first cohorted visited
• 53:00 - 53:30 Melbourne for two weeks and they got a firsthand experience what actually is the life is going to be after one year they go to the Melbourne so actually this also very important part because something we show on online and something you show and get a feel in a physical form that makes it and and this is a relationship which is actually going to go and a scale-wise also very very high so in nutshell I just want to say is that it has to be the equality has to be coming into picture both respect each other trust and affordability that's the most important part thank you so much can I add yeah
• 53:30 - 54:00 excuse me ma'am uh we all along talking about our Indian students and faculty members gaining The Experience from the International Education but India also is strong as all the other earlier speakers have said in the medical in the Allied in the community and Public Health Medicine data and social sciences so I'm sure that the Australian students would also also benefit by coming in here at the undergraduate level and you
• 54:00 - 54:30 know doing research along with our faculty and so on and so forth so this is something therefore when you talk about the previous topic on student and faculty Mobility is it physical Mobility or is it learning Mobility so a lot of research even at the undergraduate level can be done in these areas when we have these joint degrees so I just like to put this across where uh you know maybe two years or one year if the four-year degree program if for cost cutting the
• 54:30 - 55:00 final year if both sides agree we do the online uh education while they're doing that final year into the first year of postgraduation so that they can have a cost cutting in the second year through living expense so this is one Fair Point yes um I think what we were definitely looking at was how do you make this challenge work and uh that was one example of the rmit bits aspect of it and if this challenge can work keeping and addressing these issues we need to
• 55:00 - 55:30 also talk before the final comments on the opportunities which are there so I mean in terms of collab I just get you in for a quick second the opportunities are there I think I'd like to invite prer because looking at from invest India point of view what do you think are the opportunities coming in yeah thank you um when we look at opportunities in terms of collaboration I believe uh one of the areas that both sides both India and uh foreign universities including Australia must consider is uh collaboration with industry the government has not only laid stress on making India a hub for
• 55:30 - 56:00 Education through its study in India program but we are also focusing on making India and uh there have been several U announcements and policy changes to make uh it easier for um uh companies to manufacture in India which is leading to a lot of requirements for skilled Workforce and uh you know trained work force uh by 2030 there will be a requirement of 8 million um uh people required by the manufacturing sector every year so uh the universities must
• 56:00 - 56:30 consider Partnerships with industry which will be giving out um their requirements their future requirements which should be planned and all the joint degrees or any future programs that are coming up should be in line with the industry requirements so that uh uh we can uh have the skilled Workforce uh getting absorbed by the industry and of course there are several uh areas that the government has already outlined say for example semiconductor drone and you know these areas where we did not initially have or currently have
• 56:30 - 57:00 a lot of expertise so we are looking at uh um you know Australia and other countries bringing in that expertise uh the second area for opportunity is what I would suggest is tier 2 and tier three cities we are all talking about you know Premier institutes I Delhi I Bombay but what is required is also Partnerships and collaborations with universities and educational institutes in tier 2 and tier three cities we have some of the best universities and colleges there a lot of the talent is coming from those
• 57:00 - 57:30 uh cities 60% of our graduates come from tier 2 and tier 3 cities and we were talking about startups 39% of our startups are from U tier 2 and tier three cities and they all span across areas from you know BPM to deep technology so it is not just in you know the basic uh areas that the startups are working on it is also in advanced area so we have the talent in tier 2 and tier three cities there is only a requirement for them to be getting exposed Ure especially through Partnerships from these foreign universities and uh in
• 57:30 - 58:00 fact I'd also like to mention 15% of our Tech Talent is also from tier 2 and tier three cities so um two areas of opportunity that I feel uh any partnership between Indian and foreign University they should look at U collaborating with the industry and also look at tier two and tier three cities yeah so I think it's all coming back again to the same point of students coming and looking at India as a market and uh I I would just add say not just tier two tier three that just don't ignore tier two and tier three it's not just the premium number one Metro City
• 58:00 - 58:30 institutes it's tier 2 tier three which has to be picked up you would be happy to help you find the right partner yeah AB no I think lot of collaborations are possible within this as well sorry um I know that you know some of these points are open-ended still we we can actually narrow it down further with our conversations but it's just that faity of time I am I've have been given an agenda to finish this six topics and make sure that everybody catches their flights and travel plans the one topic I want to definitely pick up before we take a small five minute
• 58:30 - 59:00 breather break is managing expectations because the one thing which I'm hearing a lot more is expectations and I would love to hear from the Victorian side as well what is the expectations which are there because we've heard from India we need students coming in we need research collaborations we need industry exposure all of that but what's the expectations from Victorian side so uh for this I like to call Monty sing from victoriia University it's a bit unfair I was you're not ready
• 59:00 - 59:30 for it but you know that's that's fair that's the fun part yeah look um I've been listen I've been uh I've I've been listening to the discussions quite intently and um what we're talking about here right now and this is this goes to the heart of the managing expectations is that we still not looking at the scale that we talking about you know uh the chancellor uh probably just said 35 million people have to be upskilled
• 59:30 - 60:00 we're talking about research we're talking about you know joint prog programs say that we are not even touching the tip of the iceberg here you know look at the scale so I think in in our from our context as a provider we got to think about um managing expectations from these five points but which managing expectations often often leave a scar so I've made an acronym called SCA a r you know so um first is the scale understanding the scale how do
• 60:00 - 60:30 we manage the scale and what are the optimizations in managing that scale what are the delivery model models in managing the scale um when you come about uh scale we got to also understand the compatibility uh we're talking about the compatibility of qualifications about skills about research and how do we go about uh uh how do we go about you know bringing that compatibility together so that it actually meets the needs of uh
• 60:30 - 61:00 the future of India as well as for Australia the third I think is Administration um every tne is admin intensive and getting ex clear uh uh you know concrete uh outcomes and uh and the administration of those programs uh needs to be you know solidified and clearly expected at the end so that is SCA and this fourth is regulation uh validation regulation you
• 61:00 - 61:30 know what are the expectations of man validation and regulation ensuring that our degrees are compatible are are delivered at scale and yet uh have the rigidity and validity of of the award that we are are delivering and the fifth is recognition on uh understanding that your qualifications whether they are micr credentials or they are vocational uh qualifications or they are research qualifications or they are you know a
• 61:30 - 62:00 diploma or degree or a joint degree or D dual degree they are recognized not only by the industry by the sector by the society but also by the government and the regulation so um we've been talking quite a bit about managing expectations and U and we started off by saying you know how do we Define what an expectation is before we can manage it so um David what do you think about that uh thanks thanks Marty um David David before before you get into it sorry um a
• 62:00 - 62:30 quick one I I love to take the Indian viewpoint on the scar model because you did uh mention a couple of very key points on this one and I think that from the scale to the regulation and compatibility so if I can have Professor Kar here from s University yes thanks adya and actually thank you you have I think kind of uh uh clearly simplified it for all of us and all these points are important I I think from the Indians perspective uh the joy comes from the
• 62:30 - 63:00 fact that how the NEP has really opened up a huge number of possibilities and you know we today talk about undergrad postgrad programs and research and uh Partnerships in that and mobility in that I think we need to take it a tier lower also because today uh when we talk about expectations in a partnership I think the bigger expectation to be uh concerned and worried about is is the expectations out of us as an educational institution you sit in any industry
• 63:00 - 63:30 Academia round table and the whole conversations ad is about how we are not producing students who are ready enough for industry to absorb and how they have to then spend equal amount of money and time to Res skill them to adapt to what they need so I think that is a bigger expectation we need to and ma'am is here and can give us good inputs on that so I would say that let that be a starting point for us because we are living in a world today where you know people are even questioning the validity of a
• 63:30 - 64:00 four-year degree which makes a student get out of college with a huge debt and start his professional life his or her professional life with debt so I would challenge us to think of expectation out of us which then leads us to therefore look at what should be the expectations out of each other for this partnership so uh that would be my one point and U Monty Monty yeah very well laid out acronym I think there is a regulatory part of it there is a recognition part
• 64:00 - 64:30 of it I I would add uh sir's point of time also because sometimes uh the time involved in a partnership can build or break you know that level of expectation or otherwise so I think it's a it's a multifaceted uh sort of uh process but I think the biggest uh thing that if somebody asks me what keeps me awake is how education needs to get disrupted
• 64:30 - 65:00 uh Dr Ra always writes on LinkedIn many many uh you know insightful notes of how whether as educational institutions we are responding to that changing need of the world around us so I would sort of request us to take a step back on that expectation I think it it again comes back because um we started this discussion and somebody in the previous thing said what do actually students staff want out of us as education institutions so one of the aspect of managing expectations with the scar
• 65:00 - 65:30 model could also be first understanding what uh our students and staff are actually looking and then I was going to go to that point as my closing uh remark but I will wait for that yeah and one important observation here is that for the first time in the last 60 70 years NEP has now moved the needle on on uh uh how do we calculate gross enrollment until the NEP 2020 we've always looked
• 65:30 - 66:00 at gr as higher education for the first time we are now including vocational education as a part of that uh and that's a huge you know shift in the needle because suddenly diplomas and higher diplomas would be counted as higher education and that would probably address that 35 million because as a country we produce about 23 million children every year we continue to produce that until 2048 about 11 million children drop out
• 66:00 - 66:30 by the time they are in their eth standle by the time they complete their 12th we have about 8.5 to 9 million children that's a huge drop 45 billion drop so at the higher education if you consider 12th as a completion my population actually is half of the total population so moment you move the needle from higher to occasional you bring these million also into the system which probably doils into what you spoke of as
• 66:30 - 67:00 35 million extra the population of Australians we produce one Australia every year that's a scale we do u i I think that's what he was talking about the scale that managing expectations on scale on both the sides is important David yes if you could have your comments on managing expectations please oh thank you um and despite my colleagues intreat us to talk about the definition of expectation and to to spiral down an academic
• 67:00 - 67:30 wormhog mic it's dead you have the mic's on y y um I I I won't try and get into a definition of expectation and managing thereof but I am going to um think about uh engaging in a in a in a slight acronym battle um and uh and I thought about it because in Melbourne uh and at Melbourne we love our trams and um uh and it's in thinking about managing expectations and I heard it come up a moment ago uh there are a few things we
• 67:30 - 68:00 uh we think of and and one is time uh and an underestimation of the amount of time that is involved in uh building relationships and seeing relationships to their Optimum um is is is a challenge we need we need to manage people's expectations about that it does take time and it will require a significant um commitment from both parties in terms of time uh result resources um money of course but I think um Monty's acronym included
• 68:00 - 68:30 administrative resources which uh within a university context we often think of them as being a little bit elastic because they're uh you know they're just sort of there and we can uh you know call upon them but they aren't and uh and we need to be very careful uh to uh to to to ensure that we're going after things in a strategic way uh because those resources are are limited and of course money is uh limited but I think it came up earlier the conversation uh maybe Craig um uh my earthw Melbourne colleague
• 68:30 - 69:00 mentioned that uh uh the uh the the cats and the cream um a small amount of resources actually does uh you know lubricate this process very effectively when we were considering Opening Our uh Center and uh in which we opened yesterday we looked at a way in which we could uh uh and and John it's a center not a campus um uh the the ways in which we could activate um my academic colleagues to to uh to come to India and to engage in in activity here and it
• 69:00 - 69:30 takes only a small amount of resource to get that um interest going so resource is important the other the a is academic matching and that's the first M I've got two M's in my tram uh academic matching um somebody mentioned earlier that um this starts with relationships between academic colleagues and I couldn't agree more and I think we need to be careful and manage expectations there are ways in which we can generate some of that through incentive but we should also allow it to happen organically and stimulate it uh to happen organically
• 69:30 - 70:00 rather than in a directive model um and that lead my my my second m is mobility uh we talked a little bit about Mobility academic and student Mobility we must manage expectation that in order to uh to achieve effective long-term relationships Mobility is a key part of it so there we are that's the tram and the scar thought Prime Minister Modi is fond of a lot of people here yeah now that that works very well for managing expectations and I think it um it's all
• 70:00 - 70:30 car tra and car so these are the two mods yes can I uh also uh just uh finish this is the last time I'm going to talk I promise uh and and support uh rajita uh kar's you know comment we talking about operational uh expectation management here you know if understanding what the scill is but I think more importantly uh we are here to talk about the expectations managing the expectations
• 70:30 - 71:00 of the future Generations they demand things out of us and how are we what are we doing right now in managing our the future Generations so we have uh except one young gentleman who is the leader what we call the Future Leaders you know a parliamentarian we all have in many ways lived our life this is not about us this discussion is about the future generations and what we are going to do with them and how do we manage their expectation of what they want from us so that's
• 71:00 - 71:30 that's okay fair point if I can have um responding to this professor ner from University of Kashmir managing expectations because you said this is about Partnerships Australia for their admissions uh I must say uh a very cozy country for our youth where the parents
• 71:30 - 72:00 are also very comfortable and uh it's uh you know uh a good remark for the Australian uh you know government that you know the survey has showed there's a survey which has showed that the first country which our youth adopts to go is uh you know uh Australia now uh few things you know uh see uh definitely uh the fee structure is as such it's not
• 72:00 - 72:30 affordable uh to everyone so uh you know definitely you know some type of scholarship facilities if there can be provided would definitely help you know uh could be one of the expectations and uh from here of course students move to your country but definitely we in our own country have to uh you know come up to that expectation come up with such a infrastructure hostal facilities which
• 72:30 - 73:00 can match their uh you know needs at the international level and again uh you know other uh infrastructure uh lab structure our faculty so that the international stage uh you know uh are met at the international level so I think these two things are very important pertaining to the the last one was matching with the compatibility point on the scar sides of it I'll just
• 73:00 - 73:30 a special mess for we used to have a special separate mess for the Indian that was especially when there was Chinese students in campus and we we we have a cook actually from China during that time for them managing the cultural expectations as well comes into it right okay uh this is not U there are still two more topics which we have to understand and work but
• 73:30 - 74:00 uh yes but if depending on what the group feels uh do we want to take a five minute quick break if somebody wants a break or we continue with it okay so no break which is very good I love that yes SLS are there so we not taking any break and like I said we are just going topic by topic trying to have everybody's inputs but these are not the last inputs you mentioned this is the last you will speak no you won't because while we are finishing the conversations
• 74:00 - 74:30 we will still have more viewpoints coming in and if you have missed something on that topic yeah I know but that's why I said that we will make sure that everybody's last comments are still being taken and if you miss out on some topic please do add to it I'm coming to you straight on this so the next topic which we want to definitely uh pick up employability yeah the elephant in the room and uh this was picked up because this was about employability internships were picked up jobs were picked up Visa were picked up so
• 74:30 - 75:00 employability and we would like to invite Professor Duncan from Federation University to give us comments please thank you very much and uh I think we've touched on employability quite a bit through through the conversation um we're going to give a double act because of the two dimensions of Education postsecondary which are absolutely critically important because although we might say that higher education is is the be all and end all in fact it's probably only a third of
• 75:00 - 75:30 the postsecondary participation that we're looking for and if we're talking about skills agenda that's going to be an absolutely key component so uh my point to start is I I think reverting back in order for embro ability to work we've got to align with the government's strategy and agenda how is the government looking to uh develop uh the economy where where are the areas where we need to fill the massive skills gaps uh which are uh emerging with the
• 75:30 - 76:00 demographic change right across the world because that's where the funding is going to be and as we all know we will um follow the cream uh as Craig said and uh quite frankly if you want to um uh get outcomes from University's uh technical education you put a block of funding there we will uh follow it very quickly and you've seen that in Singapore where some of the highest um
• 76:00 - 76:30 ranked universities have moved into te technical education and skills provision in order to get access to that funding and so we need to support the government in helping them to understand where the pots of money should be so that we can help fulfill their agenda I think is is a key element the other thing is that we can't do it alone and um uh we we're a very small University Federation what we've done is we've invested in a startup which is looking at employability skills across a number of
• 76:30 - 77:00 Indian colleges because our in our view we can start another campus but we're very small we won't be able to make a big impact how do we make an impact we do it in partnering to try to go to scale and you see that also with I mean if you just go to well why do I think this will work because with the research agenda the fact of the Victorian Mission what we're doing is we're bringing all of our universities together we do very little research on our own we have to
• 77:00 - 77:30 collaborate in order to be able to achieve things and I think that the combination of uh Indian and uh and Victorian universities uh enable us enables us not only to look at research research collaboration but also the Partnerships with the industries we're doing the research for to provide the solutions because they're the ones who need the Skilling they need it all the way from vocational right through to the PHD and research and so I think that that is a provocation for us uh to be
• 77:30 - 78:00 able to respond to to that requirement and what we've also got to do in the same way as we say Well when we're designing curriculum we're designing for the students uh they must be engaged well actually we must also design it in collaboration and we've mentioned this before with the employers if the employers are not part of the design of our collaborative curriculum we won't have have employable graduates and what we're seeing increasingly if we're going to overcome um the the issue where they
• 78:00 - 78:30 say that are degrees are not relevant and you've got uh in some areas you've got up to 50% unemployment of graduates we've got to overcome that now in Victoria we're very fortunate because we have a thriving economy and we're up into the 90% employment with very high starting salaries that's something that collaboratively we should be able to help uh help each other on but that will mean working with employers to make sure that our curriculum uh brings in the
• 78:30 - 79:00 industry certifications with which we will give credit so that our students are ready all the way through to be able to do part-time work uh do the internships do the global internships and uh maximize their employability um what what I'd really like to do and I know we're going slightly out of kilter is to give the other part of the story Sally uh through through the vacational because it's part of the uh two pieces in the same
• 79:00 - 79:30 sandwich yes thank you very much and I've really enjoyed the conversation so far and in fact a lot of this conversation about employability and Vocational Skilling is where I step in uh I'm from Victoria's largest vocational Institute uh we have existed for 150 years in Regional Victoria so with my colleague here from latro University we operate as tertiary education and uh probably the point I would like to make today and perhaps to your point Duncan is relevance uh we
• 79:30 - 80:00 have remained relevant uh and our uh students remain uh are employed more often than not before they finish their vocational qualification with us employability is very strong in vocational Skilling uh half of the jobs of the future in Australia are going to require an a vocational qualification so how do vocational institutes and higher education institutes come together and and remain more relevant together okay that that that's very
• 80:00 - 80:30 relevant point I think the whole aspect of relevance coming together with vocational training and higher education and it's not necessarily about U higher education to a higher education so it's about making sure that employability as a factor I I'll make one final comment in Australia we're going through um generational change in relation to tertiary education uh it's called the cord you may have heard about it but essentially it's about no student being left behind and I think uh vocational
• 80:30 - 81:00 institutes are incredibly inclusive and so there's Pathways for people and it doesn't matter how students enter each of our institutes or how they travel through the employability is often the goal and again I think we're just two parts of the one ecosystem Sally sorry can I interrupt could you just tell us a minute about the automotive um partnership because that because that's a good example and then maybe touch on an couple of other areas where you think there's opportunities for partnership absolutely so uh we are a worldclass
• 81:00 - 81:30 Automotive Training uh at kangan Institute you may have heard of kangan uh 10 years ago an executive from maruti Suzuki was traveling the world looking for the best Automotive Training Facility to replicate it here and it's been replicated in garat at the international automotive center of excellence if you walk in there it looks like walking into our campus in docklands we have shared we've built capability we're a knowledge partner and the opportunity to scale that uh across uh the country particularly as we transition from combustion engines to
• 81:30 - 82:00 clean e electric vehicles uh hydrogen in heavy vehicle is a huge opportunity for us we have great capability in that space right now is operational correct yes it's in students uh at at Ias that's an excellent question uh how many students at Ias 6,000 it is so it was actually um uh the the minister of garat Modi at that time who uh co-funded uh this proposal with
• 82:00 - 82:30 maruchi Suzuki yes and S other areas that you'd like to collaborate yeah I think the other opportunity um so we have another part of our business which is called vet assess so you talked about Mobility between institutes students but we do the workforce Mobility so we assess every skilled migration application across over 300 occupations so as an Indian person who perhaps is a chef or a mechanic or or uh a marketing digital marketing expert we assess you for the federal government to determine
• 82:30 - 83:00 uh and assist Mobility across our um your demographic dividend that you have here in India I just have two clarifications on this mod I just have two clarifications on this model because it's about vocationalization and higher education one is who gives the diploma or the degree of that is it a university of higher education number one number two what is the age of of the student after which class you know because we have the similar model but we're facing
• 83:00 - 83:30 certain difficulties and challenges here at our Institute uh at our Institute we issue the qualifications so we issue up to Advanced diploma we choose not to operate in hireage in Bachelor uh but that's a choice of our Institute other vocational institutes in Victoria do many of the universities here are dual sector so they do uh yeah vocational and higher education but our students half of our students are over the age of 24 W I just wanted to share with you
• 83:30 - 84:00 reskilling you know generally ugc does not take the poly Technic diploma under its Ambit neither do the accrediting agencies but when we became a university and we had to merge our institutions into the private university the government of Gujarat asked us to take the poly Technic diploma Institute also under our Ambit so we are giving the degree but but ugc says we're not worried about it we are not bothered at the same time there's no recognition for that so when you say that you know NEP
• 84:00 - 84:30 is slowly merging vocationalization into uh higher education I think this is a challenge but the advantage of this is the faculty members are also getting skilled because they handle the diploma classes and the vocational classes Advantage also is that education is a concurrent subject in this country so Federal and states do have their own certain am but we have to overcome this challenge if we want to implement anything so I would like you to take this as a in a point for discussion
• 84:30 - 85:00 later a point for you as a member of I'll just add sanep just I'll just add one point here to rejoiner to us uh ma'am the S Lal uh university has found out a way of Mobility from non 10th to degree and as you rightly said the government of Punjab did support them and similarly government of guj so there is a model that is already existing just that I present to him that we will need
• 85:00 - 85:30 some support but the higher education agencies should recognize it now okay so as the point well taken and there are models which we can work on the federal structure but on this point definitely I will love to have the comments from Dr sandip chat from Diva P so the skills are different and there the in demand and out demand of the skill is different as compared to a regular degree programs now the industries are also coming forward like we recently have a
• 85:30 - 86:00 collaboration with scoda they have a university in Czechoslovakia but they have a plant at two places and like the discussion was going on they have people who have done diploma after plus two but they are not graduates so they want to be graduates and there are graduates who are working in the industry who want to become a postgraduate with skills like of electron vehicle 5G Spectrum covered vehicle things like that so there the
• 86:00 - 86:30 institutions or the university comes into picture so what we say is industry on campus ioc model somewhere it is campus in the industry somewhere it is industry on the campus now the skill deficit like a two-way movement of the skill the pleasure of getting educated and skilled in other than your country what is the thing I'm going to get and what is the thing I'm going to give so this reciprocity is there and that is
• 86:30 - 87:00 how some manufacturers like scoda Volkswagen Etc we do equally program for Tatas and other engineering and Mahindra Etc which are the country based Industries but for other Industries also which has come so the objective is Twin they want to bring out the best model in the country with the best of Technology but how the institutions and universities can collaborate so is in Australia as well in terms of bringing Industries onto campus and letting them
• 87:00 - 87:30 graduate there's many examples I'm sure each of the universities and jeel sectors here would describe it so um industry is collocated across all of our campuses in various forms since we are short of time maybe just a second uh maybe if you could just give us a little more information post this conference we will have it mailed to her it might be a worthwhile conversation to take this further because credentialing is a huge issue for us Pol Technic graduate can technically move to second year of
• 87:30 - 88:00 Engineering 10 plus three plus three that's our model so there's a structure we have but the transition doesn't happen that smoothly because higher education and vocational education has a distinct worldview until now we just grappling with it in terms of merging so this might be worthwhile for us to take up post this this discussion yeah we have done some work and and because we have this expertise in assessment in qualifications mapping with other countries as well so perhaps m is here
• 88:00 - 88:30 as well so we could help you I thing I'd like to understand from vit because they have a clear model which is working so if I can have from the V site Dr n yeah so uh you asked a question about undergraduate research so we have a model which is kind of working uh for the last 12 years which is called a semester abroad program uh again funding is an issue which uh we do it internally we have allocated every year one CR for this with good uh bright brilliant
• 88:30 - 89:00 students in the final semester uh they go to a partner University and attach to a lab and do a research so we at least we make sure that their travel expenses is taken care of so we invariably send at least 100 students every year uh which uh which is in the undergraduate level not in the Master's level which Fosters their uh search potential and most of them go into a career in research and we do an interview short
• 89:00 - 89:30 list them and introduce them to a partner University and do it so that's a model where so they get associated with a professor in an University so Advantage for the student is that they work in a lab they don't uh they don't take a course so they don't pay the fees in the university and they work on a research topic of their interest so this is also a model which uh we could do I they get the credit for the last Capstone project of uh 15 credits from them uh from V8 so this is a model which
• 89:30 - 90:00 uh can do it in both both ways so we have some students coming from outside India also for the their Project work to V8 so this is a model which we could um for the mobility and one thing is uh all this is a uh economics wise we should have more scholarships if this kind of short-term Mobility has to go on ESC scale because we are as you rightly told it's in the tip of the iceberg we are talking about and if it has to go
• 90:00 - 90:30 something like um scalability has to be there in terms of scholarships thank you all right um I also want to understand because you've just got the Telangana skill University yeah just wanted to mention one initiative of the government of Telangana just launched uh young India skills University we we named it young India because you know the future belongs the younger thing and uh is just launched and we want to make it uh less governance from the
• 90:30 - 91:00 government side uh in fact this the new this will be surprised for many we have appointed a board it's independent and the chairman of the board is Anand Mahindra tomorrow we are meeting Mr Anan Mahindra and the board the fact we really welcome this initiative and I'm glad that I'll take these discussions forward and maybe in the the months to come we'll sign up some agreements with some of your universities because we want to replicate this model and we'll do it in a big way this year our Target is 10,000 students and we'll go on to
• 91:00 - 91:30 50,000 students from the coming years this will cover a spectrum of sectors like automobile autonomous vehicles what All Electronics Nano and what all emerging areas so to speak so I welcome all of you to Hyderabad and uh to look at the skill University it's just come up and from the festival days of theera navaratri we'll be starting this University that that's what we love to hear when we talk about Partnerships and collaborations uh in a matter of RR and
• 91:30 - 92:00 a half if we start talking that okay let's sign up something that that works very well that's music to AR that's music thanks to adya we could make this and this conversation's made possible great opportunities in the future one one 30 seconds query uh
• 92:00 - 92:30 so Water Service engineer so RPL is something where you would have plenty of competence isn't it yes and it's it's an area that um we are looking to um improve and uh apply at scale in Victoria particularly because of this huge we had the largest assessment capability in the country uh so if anyone can do RPL it should be us so we are working very hard at this um and there is so much uh there's so
• 92:30 - 93:00 many people in Australia we have huge Workforce challenges uh and high skills in demand that we can't meet if we don't RPL we won't meet it huge priorities in housing if we don't do this and there's lots of laborers but if we don't recognize the skills and capabilities that they have they won't be out to progress can I add one point here yes I think something on similar lines is what bits pilani does called the work integrated learning programs welp there are something like 49,000 working
• 93:00 - 93:30 professionals registered for a degree in bits right now and these are all diploma holders already working in Industries so they can receive bachelor's degrees they can receive Masters I mean of course it stops with Masters right now but uh that that's a very huge program in bits right now 49,000 people registered today graduate and postgraduate mostly postgraduate but undergraduate some substantial part 10,000 kind of those those are
• 93:30 - 94:00 definitely areas which are possible to look at the employability side just talking about the alignment between vocational courses and higher education courses um I'm proud to say that there are three universities who here who are dual sector universities one is M Victoria university swinburn university Federation university rmit university being is being represented in proxy you know there four universities here and of course Kang and Batman and they work with you know lro we are always talking
• 94:00 - 94:30 about that vertical alignment uh of qualifications right from your technical grade qualification ucational uh qualifications to your higher education qualification and then to research and PhD as well so that is what we're talking about for example in my University you can do your electrician course and then become an electrical engineer and then become an electrical uh consultant and work in the solar panels and and the and the battery storage thing and that is something which we working on you know similarly
• 94:30 - 95:00 if you are a uh a mechanic a mechanic or auto mechanic how can you transition how can that qualification be recognized in your mechanical engineering end of years and then you you you can then go on to do other other aspects uh so uh a carpenter a chippy who we call uh doing a course in building and construction and then becoming a civil engineer in building construction and then becoming an architectural design consultant so those are things which we are looking at
• 95:00 - 95:30 and those progression we looking at and we always work at that I think that's something which India would love to collaborate and think about yeah absolutely hear about we do and just um to to add to that what we're what many of the Jew or what some of the jeel sectors will also look at is uh for the higher education students to actually undertake a vocational education qualification so for example at our University a bachelor of nursing student might take a certificate for course in mental health an engineering student
• 95:30 - 96:00 might take a welding qualification so what we're seeing is when the the point earlier around um the employability of our Stu our students and the qualifications and what is the value of a 4E qualification what we're recognizing is that some of our students are graduating but they're lacking those skills for the to create value immediately in the organization so that's where we see the value in the vocational education as well as dual sectors to ensure that they have that practical skills when they into the workforce it might be simp because I'll
• 96:00 - 96:30 also working if I'm an electrician I first work for about a few years come back get a credit I would build it overi of there different use cases different you know different what you're saying is more India um what what what they're talking about curious just just one thing which is worth uh mentioning is that the Victorian government is sponsoring a number of universities to um trial a number of these aligned
• 96:30 - 97:00 qualifications and going forward out of here it might be something that we can collaboratively do with joint governments under the um under the Victoria India approach uh to see whether we can't do some alignment with the government to government uh sponsorship of this sort of framework yeah that that could be there yes that's quite a good way forward and to the session yeah the because you said the way forward the last point would be better ways to make collaboration work and sustain so what
• 97:00 - 97:30 are the better ways and if we can have Professor farell talk about this okay I actually wanted to talk about the opportunities more broadly and to make the larger point that with regards to Australia and India this is an absolutely fantastic time for collaboration um so just think about the NEP and that's opened the door for international organizations to now collaborate in terms of uh with Indian institutions but also the policy alignment because the Australian
• 97:30 - 98:00 universities Accord that came out this year in 2024 it it identifies the exact same challenge that you are facing in India which is OBS in the workforce at scale so for you it's your ger you want to get to 50% by 2035 for we in Australia we want our equivalent is 80% by 2050 um so it's a similar policy Challenge and it's also a similar challenge alleng because the the actual Target is utterly unrealistic in terms of what government is trying to achieve and the mechanisms it's using to achieve
• 98:00 - 98:30 it so it's great to have that ambition it won't be achieved but how close can you get to it and What mechanisms can you use to get closer to it we have the exact same problem you have we're not going to meet our Target and the way government's trying to get there it's utterly unrealistic but nevertheless it gives us a Spur to raise our ambition so it's a fantastic time and one thing I would say is I completely Echo is we have to we have to get serious about alignment with vet and we in Australia some of the Dual sectors do but many of the universities do not and I think it's
• 98:30 - 99:00 for us to work in Partnership like we will with bki to get much better alignment on the research side uh again when you think about the major policy challenges that we face and Social Challenges they are closely aligned like our number one political challenge right now it's not going to change anytime soon is Urban Development and particularly the infrastructure we need for urbanization don't have enough homes our transports misaligned investment in all that costs an absolute Fortune all of our infrastructur is creaking in order to support our Urban population um climate change is caused an absolute
• 99:00 - 99:30 chaos for us basically we're now realizing all these weather patterns we're having which are really uncomfortable it's climate change and clean energy transition and the politics of clean energy transition and that's before you even get into digital transformation the AI Revolution is going to absolutely profoundly strain all of our organizations in order for us to actually Leverage What and meantime meantime our economies are going to transform below us by Tech med tech and how can we leverage those to meet the healthcare demands that we have that are growing and lastly a and food Tech I
• 99:30 - 100:00 mean we in Australia do not invest enough in agon food Tech in R&D we absolutely do not and yet we know we need to revolutionize sustainable agriculture and more nutritious food to support our population we think we think we've got Sovereign Security in food we don't we discovered during Co so these are like a profound list of of social economic and political challenges that we have which are closely lined with yours and there's the opportunity when I think about what we're doing for instance at Latrobe we've got a Fab fabulous partnership which is a good example of partnership at scale which
• 100:00 - 100:30 knocks off a number of these issues so this is the our Asian smart cities research and Innovation Network that we have in partnership with bit spani we have in partnership with I campor and tis and that's looking at particularly the liability sustainability um of uh of urban Asian cities I think the one issue we Face the challenge we face on the Australian side if I'm completely honest is meeting the appetite on the Indian side for scaling and I think like bits has been challenging us there and I think
• 100:30 - 101:00 Professor R comments are bang on basically so you have scale in terms of a talent a talent pool that is just amazing and for us of course it's leveraging the resource to meet your the appetite so we can partner at scale and I think that's a challenge that we need to take away but already I mean I think that Asin partnership is doing pretty good when I think about it it's like 443 million of joint investment by the part Partners it's 70 uh joint PhD projects it's 300 researchers working on 10 inter multidisciplinary uh research themes but
• 101:00 - 101:30 I think the challenge for most from our Indian Partners is yeah can you do that 10 10 times and that's the challenge we need to work when I think about looking ahead where the opportunities are if you think about the social political and economic challenges our two countries face and the alignment there I I would see two areas one is digital digital transformation of higher and vet higher education so that's one actually that we are very advanced in Australia but we're going to be challenged by AI for sure but I think in in India you might have a
• 101:30 - 102:00 bit of a challenge on that actually because I think your current policy settings are not sufficiently supporting and yet I know in many universities you've just cracked on and done it anyway and that's what you're going to need to close the gap in terms of the gr is proper digital transformation delivering wholly digital courses at scale and get the you get the U the University's Grand commission across the line on that one and the other is is the skills agenda and to move from a thinking about it university courses to lifelong learning working in partnership with vest on a skills agenda and I think
• 102:00 - 102:30 we in Australia we need to do much more in that but I but I also think there's an opportunity of working with our Indian Partners on that because the only way we're going to achieve the upskilling of Workforce at the level that policy has identified is look at it in a lifelong learning way and and look at the multiple ways that we can support people on their Skilling the skills they need to get on their lives and have better opportunities fascinating great you interesting thing is that both I am Bangalore and I Madras
• 102:30 - 103:00 both of them have been now pioneering the fully online delivery of courses I Madras I think has a BS in Data Systems and I am Bangalore has day4 yesterday launched a BBA in uh and both these universities a premier 13 lakh children apply to get into 20,000 seats in I but can I they changing yes can I just say um I I first designed an online course in taught it 19 years ago how right and 20 years back yeah and and that course we we designed three programs and when we delivered
• 103:00 - 103:30 them at Kings College London they were the most popular programs that the college had we had the best learning outcomes cost us a million bucks million pound sterling to design them but high quality designed online learning 20 years ago in terms of student satisfaction student outcomes was better than anything else we were delivering on campus so if you do it correctly you and when you think about you know what we need now we need to support people who are time poor who are mature age who have work and Care responsibilities it's
• 103:30 - 104:00 a no-brainer to get serious about wholly online postgraduate courses and they're high quality two decades of catching up yeah no but I think um some of the points which were raised by you were very relevant because it is about understanding that we shared same problems we talk about we talk about digital transformation skills agenda the problem is similar but what was interesting was the scale which you're talking about that if if you're looking at the scaling side of it that's where India can come in that India has a role to play on the scaling side um and this
• 104:00 - 104:30 is where we can have some of our Indian partner universities talking and collaborating on those lines as well um responding to you I'll just have sir hasn't come in so if if I can just have his comments coming in thank you very much actually I apologize for little late I am Professor GD Sharma Vice Chancellor of University of science technology meala and former president of Association of Indian universities I just completed in the
• 104:30 - 105:00 month of July so since nap 2020 there is a lot of scope for collaboration and partnership as well as flexibility we not only have opportunity for vertical growth but also horizontal as well as for uh having collaboration and collaboration at different type one semester or two
• 105:00 - 105:30 semester or both Blended or the physical mode but what I feel personally that maybe to give more exposure to the universities of our country and there it is better to organize a delegation because as a Association of Indian universities we have have taken delegation to Taiwan Spain and other countries and it is giving very good result because then this person to
• 105:30 - 106:00 person the VC to VC who are decision makers the contact comes and they also know what are those areas which they can bring to their University and what are those areas where they can have more employability and having the joint program for one semester or two semester because our main limitation comes the cost cost of the general Indian
• 106:00 - 106:30 universities students is a major limiting factor so the what we feel personally that certain areas in India like yoga ayurva as well as biodiversity and also on developing natural product could be areas which could be projected from our side where it will also help emerging areas and
• 106:30 - 107:00 also providing opportunities there sure I think I think that's that's what he was talking about that identifying the areas because you did mention climate change is creating chaos Healthcare is demands are getting very very high not enough investment in food Tech so if you talk about some of the areas which India can offer and those are the areas which could be holistic education or you like you said or any of those which is about Healthcare and that could be areas which could be identified where there is a
• 107:00 - 107:30 need for both sides to work on I think those are the areas which we can definitely pick up on so relevance and requirements on both sides become extremely critical here if if I can say actually I think just the two points I were making on the research side in terms of the Partnerships I think with the Indian Partners offer is scale because the human resource that you have which is outstanding at scale and that's an affordability issue for us and for the Australian side the challenge is certainly the non8 the challenge is around having the resource levels to
• 107:30 - 108:00 meet you at scale so that's just an issue we need to try and work and but I think on the education side it's digital because the one thing that we have deep knowledge expertise and delivered success in is a long trck record of of digital education and I think there is something we can work with our Indian partners because I think that's that's absolutely the future to get you towards that gr that you need to get to so that again comes back to the the compatibility point that how compatible are the institutes and how do we bring that up on compatibility so yes there
• 108:00 - 108:30 needs to be a little bit of two-way processes there would be scale which India would offer and there would be compatibility which India needs to do before we get under the Partnerships um we've been a fantastic uh round here and I think this is lovely because I finished my six topics now this is the time to invite and open up the Forum to say any pointers which are coming in any any ideas which you believe can lead to better collaborations and we can walk away we just heard one possible collaboration which is which might happen walking out of here but any ideas
• 108:30 - 109:00 which you believe we haven't discussed and we need to touch upon we'll spend last 10 minutes touching upon that and documenting there and imagine 20 professors kept time 20 professors actually better than time we started 10 minutes late and we still made up time so yes please point I think employability we talked from the vocational training point of view uh when we are looking at the undergraduate program with rmit one of the important point and in EI it is a typically the question which will be asked the moment
• 109:00 - 109:30 a student joins the university whether the Stu the student at the end of the graduation will he or she get a job or not be it in India or anywhere in the world and this was a fundamental question which was raised by the by the students even when we are looking for two plus two program and it's very interesting that civil engineering is not a most preferred discipline in India because of the kind of pay you get at the end of four years and join a new organization but in Australia it is a tremendous potential in terms of in
• 109:30 - 110:00 infrastructure and all that and the the it was very interesting the students were not ready to take this 2 plus2 program so employability is always is a is a very very critical point and we have to see that unless that first Cort goes there and gets employed you will not be able to Market that program and all that so this is a learning which I'm just sharing with all of you that we have to see that which is sellable and which is not sellable in ter and that is how you can receive go to the scale what you're looking for what students want in a specific country and what that country needs other country exactly so that
• 110:00 - 110:30 compatibility again and the second thing I just wanted to add one more thing what Professor say that about the uh the multidisciplinary multi- institutional collaboration is the way forward and that's the best part about it lro bits IIT kpur and tataa Institute of social sciences joining hands together bringing the the completely a different complimentary aspect of it and doing a project which is of a interdisplinary nature I think that is going to be other way forward
• 110:30 - 111:00 and that is how we can scale it up very quickly and bring the different perspectives so that's I just yes yes ice cream so we we are part of the collaboration there uh but what he was mentioning is the scale that is what is very important so we need to look at that true absolutely yes yeah uh I've been listening to everyone for the last 40 45 minutes but uh one thing that U I it's more like a suggestion The Way Forward is for all the Australian universities also here I think uh you need to take bit more risk when I say
• 111:00 - 111:30 bit more risk don't don't just confine yourself to I IMS and aims of this country uh you know that's what I've been hearing all all the time ra Prof ra is here I'm not trying to bring them down anything like that but there are limitations and flexibility issues when you come to these institutes but uh and and lot of lot of members have expressed about scale also when you when you're looking for scale and impact more than the scale I see the
• 111:30 - 112:00 impact when you have to make the impact that happens only when where the numbers are there where the students are there where they coming from that uh 90% of them come outside of this institutes IM iats and all these things so I think you need to take a bit more risk rather than stay safe and say okay I only engage with these uh it's not going to go anywhere if if you going and sit there sit like that sit very tight like that a fair point I think this is what there was echoing
• 112:00 - 112:30 that uh majority of our graduates are coming out of tier 2 and tier three cities and even if the not the top bracket of the top 20 institutes in the country so yes there is definitely u a need to reassess that the Partnerships need to be with institutes which can bring scale which can makeig impact on ground and not just the traditional old conventional names to work with I think uh that's that's exactly where you're talking about that and Krishna runs a fascinating University in also one of the other thing with
• 112:30 - 113:00 regards to the Skilling is you know in this country right now the catch food is uh there's a population census that's going to happen uh but Andra Pradesh is coming forward as a state and been professing for a skill census for whole population uh like whoever is about 16 17 who finished their schooling so I think that it's a good opportunity that someone like you can take it forward so Skilling and employability always and that's why we use the word
• 113:00 - 113:30 elephant in the room because everything we do ends up back with what students want and what they want is employability or entrepreneurship they want to have careers so I think it all comes back to that any other comments uh suggestions inputs uh so we were talking about I IMS because uh all of us are early place even before the ne into picture and with the NEP in force I'm pretty sure that all the there is lot of flexibility because a small a college in Tire two or
• 113:30 - 114:00 Tire three City earlier before 2020 can never think about academic collaboration or credit transfer but now it's practically possible and if two two years down the line we may be if we are here we will be talking something with the tire two and tire three cities more that's what I think Victoria IND initiative absolutely just one point yes Professor I think you know going forward of course the scale for the all these collaborations needs to happen that will
• 114:00 - 114:30 require a financial model I think we need to start looking at it and uh the second thing is I see a huge opportunity to bring our incubators together not much effort has happened on that yesterday I saw at least one mou being signed but uh but I think India is a Powerhouse of talent when it comes to even the startups and uh Australia you know has is also doing reasonably well I think if you can bring the incubators together through proper M and at the
• 114:30 - 115:00 government level kind of a thing another thing is all these programs at some point will require industry involvement industry involvement on the Australian side industry involvement on the Indian side I think if if our industry bodies like CIA fiki others here and similar bodies in Australia if they can also start collaborating with each other and you know take into account the ongoing M ongoing collaborations between universities and how they can support I
• 115:00 - 115:30 think that would have you know been very good we are still struggling all the joint programs today I think the industry participation is still very Meer I mean so how can we improve on that is also i' I'd like to just support that comment it's re really handy in the in the sense that traditionally Australia has tended to go perhaps through Cali California for US market access to quick commercialization if we could find a similar route um through to
• 115:30 - 116:00 um through to India that would be extremely useful we're fortunate uh um that former Premier Brumby hits the Breakthrough Victoria fund U and it but it just goes to show that the government is focus Victorian government is very much focused on the commercialization side and again where where the government is is is supporting that and we can have government government um support for commercialization and Market access because we're a small um country
• 116:00 - 116:30 so it's much more difficult for us to go to a large scale market and try and test and fail but this would be a very good collaboration just just very very quickly because we signed with bck yesterday um the mo the loou which is around an innovation Corridor and so it's an innovation Corridor between the state between Melbourne and um Bangalore and that's going to be around bioinnovation but that's going to be one of a number of innovation corridors and and so it's going to be supporting startups and entrepreneurs in India and and but also in Australia to have that
• 116:30 - 117:00 two-way exchange but critically of course for Indian startups to gain access into the Australian Market to meet our regulatory requirements because that is a platform into the American market and so there's a kind of logic behind this so I think I totally agree with Professor or I think there is the big opportunity actually I think so the government of government is one thing but looking at startups incubators as a market which which can definitely be coming in and Industry involvement of course that's that's what we've been hearing that if it's a two-way if it's employability which has to be created two-way then Industries on both sides
• 117:00 - 117:30 have to be involved in the entire process and collaboration or research will need to have industry engagements as well on both the sides so that definitely is a point we need to in fact I think Australia has a great lead when it comes to India University collaborations I mean I was recently in Canada not a single University in Canada has any mou with any Institute in India for a joint program why because they they are not even allowed to do that I mean they engineering programs cannot do
• 117:30 - 118:00 any joint programs with anybody and they need some approvals from some body and they don't even want to go through those processes I think you are sitting very pretty you know America doesn't care Europe anywhere nothing much is happening I think Australia has a has a great lead here can I can I just uh add one point I just want to give a real time example of of confidence building of how the Australian universities can take uh collaboration to the tire two cities basically I've spent 37 years of my
• 118:00 - 118:30 profession in Tamil Nadu in K and that's where the autonomous status started in way back in 1978 so most of those institutions right from 1980 have had collaborations with the US universities and the European universities and it's still going strong and they're doing very well so just you can take the risk definitely with the tire two and TI three cities I just like to share this with you no I think with this we'll just
• 118:30 - 119:00 like to hand over to uh you as a chair for the final comments and uh we'll keep time because we do know that this is important but uh we will uh definitely document it like I mentioned the six pointers which we picked up we discussed it briefly some of some we went in depth some we did just touch upon a few points some needs more discussion so we will definitely float those and ask for inputs where we have missed but over to you about the session how long have I got
• 119:00 - 119:30 AER how long have I got how long have I got no sorry I was being factious it's okay I won't take that long I won't take that long I was going to I was going to uh firstly thank thank you and mesh for the your moderation it's been really excellent It's been fantastic I think it's been a great discussion actually uh and I think uh the proof of that at the end when you ask is there any more comments and there's lots of comments coming from around the room so this is such a good conversation to to have uh I
• 119:30 - 120:00 know we've had a lot of acronyms um I know the Prime Minister was his birthday yesterday uh and I know he loves acronyms but I'm not going to get into acronyms uh but I but I did take a lot of notes I took pages of notes and um and and I do have some just some some dot points to run through which will just take two or three minutes but um Craig Jeffrey started with the the three TS and I think they're pretty relevant and and that was time time and commitment uh teamwork and a two-way
• 120:00 - 120:30 relationship and those themes were repeated I think through many of the uh the presentation uh another letter that was used a lot was the the C uh C for uh cost cost came up from a number of people it's not the biggest issue it's not the only issue but it's an important issue the cost of doing research SE Arch I think came up phds can we take some of the cost out of that and the cost of undergraduate degrees it's a it's a it's a big it's a big issue big issue for our
• 120:30 - 121:00 students in Australia big issue for students here in India so cost was important uh cream the word Cream came up as an incentive and I think Duncan uh you might have mentioned that I think some other speakers mentioned that so um getting academics to move getting academics to work together sometimes incentives that are put in place Place sometimes the bit of cream from government can make all the difference in incentivizing people uh co-design came through as a fundamental theme so
• 121:00 - 121:30 uh co-design of joint degrees not going it alone but again it went to the collaboration to the teamwork codesign and I think the the perhaps in many ways the most important of those series that came through was uh collaboration with industry because in turn that went to the ew which was employability and I think in this huge challenge to upskill this huge scaling challenge to upskill
• 121:30 - 122:00 if the people who are graduating with degrees haven't got the skills and unemployable there's a question mark about the investment that the state has made and the investment those individuals have made so for me that came through really strongly so employability a people job ready work integrated learning all of those things get um uh wrapped in together uh digital
• 122:00 - 122:30 transformation uh Professor Farrell mentioned that he mentioned that 30 years ago he uh created his first 30 years ago oh 20 sorry about that I'm I'm aging him so I'm not allowed to do that I'm dating so it's 20 years ago uh first online course uh but I can show my age because when I trained as a secondary teacher more than 30 years ago uh I created what was described at that time
• 122:30 - 123:00 as a learning activity package and of course we didn't have Google and we didn't have the internet but a learning activity package was all of the bits and pieces audio tapes videos slides all of the things that you needed for a student to learn at their own pace individualized learning and really the digital Revolution and online has morphed into that it's individualized learning where students can learn at their own pace in their own time in
• 123:00 - 123:30 their own location so that's a big issue um Mobility M for Mobility we heard about that uh R NE talked about what what is it the teachers and students want you know you've got to start with that so infrastructure cost Hybrid models all of those sort of things but starting with the needs of the students and the needs of the teachers uh it's got to be two-way and then I guess the two things that in the big scheme of our discussion today really jumped out um the
• 123:30 - 124:00 opportunity word so you know I mentioned in my remarks at the at the opening uh what our Australian High Commissioner Philip green said yesterday about the opportunity of this relationship at this point in time and when I think of all of the opportunities the Australia India relationship lots of them but the one that's right at the top is is education you know it's it's education it's entrepreneurship it's startups it's
• 124:00 - 124:30 research it's all of that partnership I think that's at the it's it's at the top of the triangle so I think of opportunity and I think as Professor Farrell said upskilling at scale and then that brings me to the last point which is scale you know and um mesh you talked about the population growth and then the numbers of students pushing through uh I think an Australia population being born every year and then pushing through to the numbers that
• 124:30 - 125:00 then work into the vocational system and the higher education system and then you put on top of that the NEP Target up to 50% it's just a huge challenge to meet those targets so for me the scale issue is really important and certainly after our week here I'm encouraging all of our delegation uh from Victoria to go back and to think about um and and I guess
• 125:00 - 125:30 it's the b word bold uh bold Solutions right what are the things that we can do together that that aren't just sort of nibbling at the edges um but that are bold and Visionary and can really meet that challenge of upskilling at scale and as the Ambassador said the High Commissioner said there's never been a better time and a better opportun to do it so I thought it was a fantastic discussion um uh thank you and thank you for the hospitality too that we've been extended uh today uh it's been great the
• 125:30 - 126:00 conference floor was uh great and this round table has been really excellent so thank you very much thank you thank you so much absolutely um if I'm allowed to add I think one point which I definitely want to add and that is uh the last point which I said uh be bold what you mentioned be bold and be bold in all your Partnerships look at relevance on both the sides look at compatibility and it's not just the existing conventional models but it's B bold to look at different models of collaboration which are possible with all kinds of
• 126:00 - 126:30 institutes and organizations in this country so thank you so much for that and uh thank you everybody for being here and being a part of this session we look forward to your comments and inputs in the coming days and please do enjoy the evening and if you do get time join us again in the exhibition and we'll see you soon thank you so much uh yes if you can have one picture together it's always nice to have such thought leaders in a room one
• 126:30 - 127:00 picture