Thundercat on Drunk, Kendrick, Zappa & Kenny Loggins

Summary

In a revealing conversation with Tom Power, Thundercat dives into the intricacies behind his album 'Drunk,' exploring the lyrical and thematic choices that reflect society's chaotic state. He discusses the digital disconnect in today's social environment, the influence of social media, and collaborations with renowned artists like Kendrick Lamar. The musician offers deep insights into his creative process, his inspirations from artists like Frank Zappa and Kenny Loggins, and the importance of honesty in music. Amid laughter and poignant observations, Thundercat reveals the emotional turmoil and growth experienced during the album's creation.

Highlights

• Thundercat shares the thematic meaning behind his album title 'Drunk,' reflecting society's chaotic essence. 🍷
• The digital age makes people feel disconnected, akin to being 'drunk' on social media, according to Thundercat. 📵
• Collaborating with Kendrick Lamar was a transformative experience, breaking conventional artistic boundaries. 🎙️
• Frank Zappa's influence is pivotal in Thundercat's music, pushing boundaries of creative expression. 🎷
• Thundercat uses humor to address serious societal issues, blending poignant observations with whimsical tunes. 🎭
• Thundercat speaks on the emotional toll of producing 'Drunk,' yet finds pride in the chaos of the process. 🌀

Key Takeaways

• Thundercat's album 'Drunk' reflects society's chaos and the digital disconnect, akin to a drunken state of confusion. 🍷
• The album title stems from societal observations rather than personal experience, highlighting the surreal social media influence. 📱
• Collaborating with Kendrick Lamar on 'To Pimp a Butterfly' was a deep, engaging experience, profoundly affecting Thundercat's musical approach. 🎶
• Music legends like Frank Zappa and Kenny Loggins heavily influence Thundercat's music, emphasizing musical experimentation and honesty. 🎸
• Thundercat conveys serious themes through whimsical music, using humor as a coping mechanism for life's realities. 😂
• Working across multiple projects, Thundercat describes the creation of 'Drunk' as chaotic yet incredibly rewarding. 🎤

Overview

Thundercat, in his conversation with Tom Power, unravels the layers behind his album 'Drunk.' He explains the album's title as a metaphor for the world's current chaotic state, where nothing seems to make sense, much like a drunken stupor. It's about the digital disturbance and the societal disconnect where everything feels lax and weird.

The multi-talented artist discusses his meaningful collaboration with Kendrick Lamar, notably on the acclaimed 'To Pimp a Butterfly' album. Working with Kendrick was akin to a creative exchange that stretched and molded his perspective, much like kneading dough—transformative and intense. Thundercat remains inspired by Kendrick's authenticity and visionary artistry.

In addition to his collaborations, Thundercat draws inspiration from musical legends like Frank Zappa and Kenny Loggins. His work embodies a unique blend of whimsy and depth, addressing serious themes with a light-hearted approach. Despite the chaotic process of creating 'Drunk,' he embraces the honesty and emotion that shines through the music.

Chapters

• 00:00 - 02:00: Introduction and Album Discussion The chapter titled 'Introduction and Album Discussion' begins with a conversation about the new album called 'Drunk.' The discussion centers around the various interpretations of the word 'drunk' in relation to the album. The artist mentions that the title encompasses themes beyond its literal meaning, such as the current essence of life, and the chaotic and surreal feelings that characterize the times we live in. The conversation highlights the complexity and depth of the album's themes, reflecting on the laid-back yet bizarre nature of everything today.
• 02:00 - 05:00: Societal Reflection and Social Media The chapter titled 'Societal Reflection and Social Media' explores the disorienting nature of contemporary society, particularly as it is influenced by social media. It describes a sense of cognitive dissonance, where interactions may feel nonsensical or akin to the experience of being 'drunk' or 'blacked out.' Social media is portrayed as a blank, overwhelming space that contributes to a confused societal state. The reflection on society is likened to being metaphorically intoxicated, where clear perceptions and understandings are hindered.
• 05:00 - 07:00: Collaboration with Kendrick Lamar This chapter discusses the experience of being so engrossed with technology, such as computers or phones, that one becomes disconnected from the present moment, similar to how one might feel detached while traveling or in a cab. The conversation touches on personal habits related to phone usage and how it affects social interactions and perception of reality.
• 07:00 - 11:00: Musical Influences and Frank Zappa The chapter titled "Musical Influences and Frank Zappa" explores themes related to the irrevocable changes in life and the passage of time. The speaker reflects on never encountering the familiar elements of their past, like a specific street or a steel mill, symbolizing the inevitability of change and the focus on future experiences. The discussion focuses on whether the acknowledgment of these changes is an impetus to alter the course of action or merely a means to recognize and inform others of their occurrence. The speaker suggests that multiple interpretations can be derived from these reflections, indicating an introspective examination of personal and broader life transitions.
• 11:00 - 17:00: Reflections on Racial Identity In the chapter titled 'Reflections on Racial Identity,' the discussion focuses on the inevitability of change and growth, particularly in the context of racial identity and awareness. The speaker highlights that while change is a constant part of life—such as aging and mortality—how one chooses to engage with identity issues can differ. There's a sense that the responsibility of addressing racial identity may not fall solely on the individual but involves a level of observation and reporting which contributes to an ongoing dialogue. The speaker reflects on the importance of acknowledging these dynamics while recognizing that personal change is ultimately an internal choice.
• 17:00 - 22:00: Music as Authentic Expression The chapter 'Music as Authentic Expression' explores the significance of music as a genuine form of self-expression and its impact on the listener's emotions. It features a discussion about the song 'Walk On By' featuring Kendrick Lamar and performed by Thundercat. The narrative captures the evolution of emotions experienced while listening to music, highlighting the potential for music to evoke strong feelings such as anger, prompting a return to reality. The chapter underscores the personal and emotional journey one undergoes while engaging with music.
• 22:00 - 28:00: Connection with Michael McDonald and Kenny Loggins This chapter seems to revolve around themes of isolation and connection within a musical context or metaphor. The mention of 'drinking alone,' 'eyewitness binoculars,' geographical references such as 'Argentina' and 'Africa,' suggests a wide-ranging exploration or personal journey. The text touches on mastering difficulties ('pressure') and resilience in the face of adversity ('harassing us'). It hints at a narrative of confrontation and survival, perhaps in the competitive or artistic arenas ('body bags,' 'price tags'). Overall, the chapter might analyze collaboration, conflict, and identity within a creative or life journey.
• 28:00 - 35:00: Discovering Gino Vannelli This chapter delves into the narrator's past, focusing on themes of violence, identity, and regret. The narrator recounts a specific incident involving a plot against an unfamiliar face, hinting at a history of crime and conflict. Tensions are high, and there's an underlying sense of unease, as court cases and territorial boundaries are mentioned. Through this turmoil, reflections on personal guilt and the inevitability of their actions surface, offering a grim view of the choices made and the life led.
• 35:00 - 39:00: Creativity and Artistic Growth The chapter titled 'Creativity and Artistic Growth' highlights a conversation with an artist discussing collaboration and the impact of previous works. The transcript mentions a project with Kendrick Lamar, focusing on artistic experiences and musical processes. Key figures include Thundercat and his collaboration with Kendrick Lamar on the acclaimed 'To Pimp a Butterfly' album. The narrative provides insights into creativity and personal growth through music and artistic partnerships.

Thundercat on Drunk, Kendrick, Zappa & Kenny Loggins Transcription

• 00:00 - 00:30 the new album's called drunk there's a lot of different ways to interpret that title I'm wondering what ways you were thinking about the word drunk for this new project oh man um good question um I think that it speaks a lot more to than more more to so many other things other than the actual literal term you know what do you mean like you know life and how everything feels right now kind of a mixture of that with like um you know um just kind of like uh the how LAX ofical and how like weird everything is you
• 00:30 - 01:00 know it feels like that socially you know it feels like you're drunk walking around and that nothing really makes any sense nothing makes any sense you know it doesn't like within five seconds of talking to somebody you can just realize it like what the what is going on right now you know it's just like it's weird so so the album title is many ways a reflection of how you're seeing Society right now yeah yeah almost like we're like even in the you know metaphorically where like you would be like okay blacked out like a lot of the time you know social media is like this Blank
• 01:00 - 01:30 Spot in a sentence in your life you know like every time you connect to the computer you just blank out for a second you're not a person for about a good if when you really get into it you just disappear for a second well I never thought about that you're right like when those times when you're in a cab and you're in the back of the cab and you're on your you're not you might as well not be there even though you're like in a whole another world which is the whole world entirely you're just not in that moment do you ever do you ever travel and look at do you look at your phone a lot oh my God I don't even talk to people man I look at my phone a lot and I travel and I think I'll never see
• 01:30 - 02:00 that street ever again as long as I live I'll never see like that that steel mill ever again but I'm not looking at it no it's just part of the it's part of how it works now you're you know it's like you're more concerned about with like what like future's going through yeah so so so is this you is this you trying acknowledging it and trying to change it or is it acknowledging it to to let us know about it I mean I mean I don't feel like there's there's there's a lot of different um things that you can take from it but at the same time time I feel
• 02:00 - 02:30 like it's not something that I'm trying to you know I feel like people would have to want to change it themselves you know like something has to change regardless it's like regardless of if you acknowledge it or not it's like you're going to grow up you're going to get old and you're going to die so inside of that you know there's things that you can try to move around you know or try to change and stuff like that so it's like I don't I I don't put so much responsibility on it like that but it's one of those things where it's more of like observation you know and Reporting let's listen can you listen to some
• 02:30 - 03:00 music is that cool yeah that's fine let's listen to some music I'm glad I'm glad that's fine this is uh this is a song featuring Kendrick Lamar this is Walk On By this is Thundercat I'd imagine I'd get really angry as the songs are going by so just turn it off yeah like come back and I'm like hit [Music] it the end of it it no one wants to
• 03:00 - 03:30 drink alone baby that's how it goes from eyewitness binacular to Argentina and Africa uh-huh we Master the pressure yeah Hazard us harassing us you laugh at us my ACC baging dim now we baging Rhymes body bags price tags on your forehead nine times out of 10 Young n 10 when that
• 03:30 - 04:00 line becomes thin be a killer or firan fill up the livest pin if I needed to write my wrongs I can't deny sin condolences through these Palms I remember when your cousin was coming home but we ploted to kill him cuz we ain't nor unfamiliar face nervous convicted court cases might hit the surface restricted territories might come through lurking we won none of that urgent call Lama at turban fall of my identity perets for a headaches I'm about to bring confet tumble out this Barrel soon as it ring you ready that was the word for we moved on them treat them like Jo the plum I wonder if
• 04:00 - 04:30 someone coming can see this tool on them immature what you call me your cousin W come home from the pin but from the h if I can write my wrongs it being his verse I read even though a bullet hit him in the leg still Walk On [Music] By it's a bit of Kendrick Lamar is featured on a song called Walk On By off the new record from my guest in studio right now Thundercat mhm you work really closely with Kendrick on the to pimpa Butterfly record which is one of the most successful most widely claimed and
• 04:30 - 05:00 and one of the most beautiful records anyone's heard in a really long T man what can you tell me about working with him the guy is amazing yeah you know to say the least and uh I don't know it's like a I would try to talk to him as much as possible you know throughout and after you know and we still talk every day for the most part you know and we kind of trip out off of Life CU it's like it's like it changed things when that album happened you know we didn't realize it was going to do anything of that sort M but it was like um we could see we we could kind of look and try to
• 05:00 - 05:30 like oh this is this is going to be a interesting you know whatever is to come from it and you know from there it was like U I don't know it just it just um I don't know it just still resonates you know something that we all wanted for it but we didn't know how it was going to translate you know and working with him throughout the process for me was like very it was like being kneaded like a like a piece of dough you know it felt like somebody was like B and stretching
• 05:30 - 06:00 and like you know yeah pulling different things out and um you know it's like a I've never experienced anything like that in working situation ever it's funny you mention that that idea of being needed with you know with a K needed like a piece of doughe because I know that going into making this record you were uncertain whether he was going to be able to accept your ideas or you'd find it you found it difficult that he would you found it difficult the idea that he would accept your ideas what do you mean by that well a lot of the time with rappers they they exist in their own space and so because of that they
• 06:00 - 06:30 don't not only do they not allow people there it's like a very it's like a I would imagine that even the act of rapping sometimes is like you have to talk about yourself so much that you think it's just yourself so a lot of the time that's been my experience with different people that I've worked with you know and being that I'm a musician first and it's like the thing that I have is a piece that works that has to fit in a puzzle so it's never I know it's never just me regardless you know but it's one of those things where I've experienced in the past moments where people would just be kind of like you
• 06:30 - 07:00 know you know to themselves and it's like once they've gotten something from you they don't talk to you anymore all kinds of stuff like that so I guess it was my you know my experience that would make me assume or L make me believe lead me to believe that you know that there was once that happened that that that was that was it but the truth is Kendrick would always let me know otherwise and I would never I didn't feel I don't know I don't usually feel comfortable asking people to do stuff for me like that you know but as I would play I would send them music all the time regardless if I was working on an
• 07:00 - 07:30 album or not I still do it you know it's like if I've done something new it's immediately I send it to them you I think a lot of performers of your caliber will will only look to people they can improvise with you know you look at people who can play bass the way you can they'll they'll want to play with other keyboard players at that level uh they want to play with saxophone players at that level with drummers at that level it seems from from looking at your career and looking at who you work with people like Kendrick yeah it seems like you're looking for something a little bit deeper what do you look for in a in a collaborator rather than just technical skill I just look for the genu genuine
• 07:30 - 08:00 love and appreciation of what it is that they're doing a lot of the time not the the hype or the celebrity of or the you know I'm I'm into the ideas I'm into like the new Uncharted Territory you know I'm into like what can this be you know especially if both of us are there you know and um it's not one-sided you know where somebody's looking at me and just waiting for me to do everything or you know those different types of things happen sometimes you know but specifically with Kendrick I saw
• 08:00 - 08:30 something completely different you know a guy that would want to it was like it would become interweaved in like the thread of what was going on throughout the course of the day and he's still and he's he's been the same person since I've met him and it's like um again that's why he's he I feel like you know the more and more I see the accolades this guy gets and stuff like that it's totally like merited because he's really that guy and it sounds to me what like what you're saying is it's something greater than just music it's something yeah he sees it he sees it man had rul
• 08:30 - 09:00 peek who made the new documentary I'm not your negro about James Baldwin the other day and he ends the documentary with the black or the berry and I as and I asked him why he played a Kendrick Lamar song at the end of it and he said because I honestly feel like the torch is being passed from someone like James Baldwin not a musician James Baldwin great thinker a great writer a great activist to to Kendrick Lamar and you see that too I absolutely see it because it's like it Bears so much weight but it's light as a feather you know it's like in one sentence it's like it's a political statement in the next sentence
• 09:00 - 09:30 it's like the black experience the next experience is everybody's experiences it's like it's it's all mesh together and it's like it's a undescribable feeling when you really think about it when you hear it you feel like it's you you feel like it's him you can feel that it's people music you can feel that it's like it's big so it's like that I think that's what's happening with people when they hear that album you know even like the little like even when you the funny thing is like watching the music videos for it when you know like as compared to the recording of it where it was like the it I I could totally see like the
• 09:30 - 10:00 moments like the Laughing to Keep from Crying the the you know the comedy and the horror and like the anger and like the love I could see all the like like really brilliant color I could see him in brilliant colors almost you know it was like whoa you know it's like this guy is out here on fire you know and I think that's what people have been experiencing when they've seen Kendrick for the last you know so odd years and it's like um you know that's what makes him who he is though and I know that laughing instead of crying has been something that's been really important
• 10:00 - 10:30 to you throughout this oh man well you know yeah you know there's so many denotations and stuff you know it's like just being black period is always a funny thing you know what do you mean well I always have this thing where I would be like um it's like I run it I run it through the test of could it be cuz I'm black yeah you know it's like you just judge everything based on that it makes everything funny you know like and then there's that one time that someone doesn't laugh and then it is oh it is cuz I'm black and you're like oh crap you know you know exactly exactly dude it becomes like you know but that's a
• 10:30 - 11:00 good litmus test yeah yeah I understand I want to talk a little bit more about your music and also the idea of of laughing through crying is is is to wrap this music in a really interesting way this is a song called Jamil's space ride and because it's short enough that we can play the entire song yeah can you can you set it up for us um well it's that it's that one time I woke up and I was just really uh I didn't know what to think what do you mean I don't know I mean a lot of the time with songwriting I don't um have a
• 11:00 - 11:30 a way it comes about in in in a consistent manner it's very different every time and it's like I remember you know it's like a lot of the time I'll be listening to music and music that I've had I've been mowing over for a while or stuff like that you know I'll be hearing Melodies but I'll never put the two and two together for it doesn't always happen immediately and so I remember I just remember I woke up one day and I think I may have had a conversation with Jamal and just realized how volatile he really was like you know like when you look at a person like oh crap you really are a
• 11:30 - 12:00 monster You Know M and so I just had that realization about my little brother let's take a [Music] Liston I want to go right I'm safe on my block except for the cops p a attack could it be CU I'm black [Music]
• 12:00 - 12:30 I want to ride away off in the space and into the sun with all the spirits and space do and Aliens Where We Belong although it seems like it's all crashing down I just want to ride byebye through all the With The Wind in my face miss me with that nonsense I'm free as a bird and light as a wind just leave me
• 12:30 - 13:00 alone just let me ride off in a spaceace that's where I want to [Music] be let's call that the radio edit of jam space ride new music from Thundercat my guest right now it's from his new album drunk you know I I it does relate to what we were just talking about the idea of laughing through crying your kind of lpus test that you put people through of is it because I'm black and you see you see whether you
• 13:00 - 13:30 get that laugh or whether you get that stern look in how that informs you but but there is it's it's a serious song This there are things you talk about in that song that aren't aren't incredibly funny that are that that are that are real life yeah um yet the way you sing it and the way we're laughing about it and the music behind it it's yeah it's it's actually Whimsical and kind of poignant at the same time I appreciate that um tell me about how you come up with that how you fuse those two things together
• 13:30 - 14:00 uh just being black it's just I mean as silly as that sounds it's like a lot of the time you know it's like you wake up and every day you're you're you're still like there's still remnants of like people that don't believe you're a full human being and that being like a reality where you like you know you know I remember the the day I realized like you know even like in the Constitution where there was like citizens with a Capital C and citizen with a lowercase C it's like well who are they talking to with the lowercase and it was like oh it's cuz I'm black
• 14:00 - 14:30 it's like oh but it's like one of those things at the same time that you know it's like I don't know it's it's not there to scare you I don't think it's not there to discourage you you know it's there for you to be resilient and like it's not something to where you can let it linger and hang over your head in such a dark manner because if you do you'll just you know you'll wither up and die and you'll be an angry bitter person when I listened to that song I listened to the record for the first time full disclosure last night mhm and um I think we were we were trying to
• 14:30 - 15:00 figure out how to make heads or taals of it and I put it on and immediately I thought Frank Zappa hey like I got it I I I thought that right away especially track one uh I heard but also I you know I I I I want to talk a little bit about Frank zppa but first am I right is he a big influence on you oh man by a man you hit it right on the head dude he's like a he's like a genuine solar flare man that guy is a beast monster what do you get from him everything man Zappa was the one dude you know I mean you know I
• 15:00 - 15:30 mean of course you know there's there's more ones but there's like Zappa in his his like every last part of what he did was amazing you know and some people love to categorize things they love they can't wait to put it in a category oh it's a jam band I'm like you call that stuff like jam music and it's like no that's written out that's like Beyond classical that's like it's transcended Jazz it's like it's gone into another place where it's like it's dancing around in this weird Cosmic thing you know and anything from the part where he
• 15:30 - 16:00 has like Benny Cuda and George Duke in his band you know you know and it's like from that to like everything to where his son still plays his music it's like it's so important like the stuff that he did you know one of my favorite albums of course or favorite two albums are apostrophe and overnight sensation um it's one of those things where it's like I I remember the day I heard um Uncle Remis MH and this was the one I remember the moment where I I I I discovered that Zappa did a version of George Duke's song and it was like it
• 16:00 - 16:30 was crazy hearing and I would play both of them back to back and I was like this is insane to realize like how this one painful moment translates like this into Frank Zappa's music and it's they're both beautiful as hell but the context in which Frank Zappa would be talking about it you wouldn't un it it almost seemed out of it wasn't out of context but it was just like what is he talking about but then hearing George Duke saying it it was like oh that's that it was deep for me moments
• 16:30 - 17:00 like that so it's like anything from that to like you know of course St Alfonso's pancake breakfast or a a a Dynamo Hum or well what I was thinking about especially when it as it relates to that last record is um brown brown shoes don't make it Mothers of Invention yeah man this uh if you don't know Frank Zappa's early work was contained in a band that wasn't necessarily a band but it was kind of a 9inch nails e style band where it was a band but it was Frank Zappa no that I would call them a jam band Jam maybe so yeah just for the
• 17:00 - 17:30 sake of if that was going to be the one thing you know because it was like it was very Jammy you know what we what we forget about Frank Zappa when we talk about him now is that not unlike yourself and I mean this in in in the kindest possible way there is social commentary there is there is justce there's there's sadness contained in what seems like absurd highly technically profession and funny songs so you look at a song like brown brown shoes don't make it which is a song about Lyndon Johnson going to Vietnam and not tell the press and the Press
• 17:30 - 18:00 realizing that he's doing it because he's wearing brown shoes with a black suit something he would never do cuz he was so welld dressed he writes this kind of very funny song this kind of absurd song it's I think it's off Joe's Garage um and it's it's it's it's absurd but it really delivers a point which is another fantastic album man Joe's Garage but how much did that how much did that idea of delivering a point a very serious point and and Vietnam was a very serious point and and and and and and the treatment of African-Americans by the police by
• 18:00 - 18:30 society and by the Constitution is a very serious Point what do you learn from PRACK Zappa on how to treat those how to treat those issues through music well I think across the board music is like a means of therapy it's also a means of like relief you know so there's you find sanct sanctuary in music a bit sometimes you really can you know and it's like I was saying earlier where it's like light as a feather but then as heavy as like a stone you know it's like it's it's one of those things where I don't know I think you come to that you
• 18:30 - 19:00 at some point you come to that conclusion you know it doesn't matter what walk of you know music or whatever it is you come to that conclusion of what is this you know and what can it be you know and it's just it's just about sometimes maybe you hit it earlier or you don't you know and for me I've always been a person that was like one to dig for records and one to look for things and try to understand what it was about you know I would and I would try to walk in another person's shoes a lot
• 19:00 - 19:30 of the time so when I would listen to music I wouldn't be listening to music just because it sounded cool or like it would be like oh cool you know it's like on another level cuz they're playing fast and crazy it's like I'd be listening to it for what makes it fast and crazy like I be like what's going on in the guy's mind that's making him tick like this and with Zappa he would tell you right out you know he would just say it it you know it didn't have to make total sense in the moment where you're like oh that's crazy he's talking about this then he mentions his balls and then he's talking back again about the it's
• 19:30 - 20:00 like it it's all what really goes on in your mind what's like what's really going on in your mind you know which is what people don't always want to know it's like you know like the thing with the truth you know it's like yeah people say they want to know the truth but then when you tell them the truth it actually pisses him off and it's like well am I supposed to get shaken by the fact that you got pissed off or am I supposed to feel awkward about telling you the truth it's like I don't know at what point I don't know what the line is and that's where that stuff exists that I don't know what this is and now when you're making your own music is is is that
• 20:00 - 20:30 truth like again Zappa you know he'll talk about porn He he'll talk about sex he'll talk about food I'll talk about politics I'll talk about consumerism is is is that informed in this record and drunk the truth well I mean again it's like everybody's truth is can be different sometimes you know and a lot of the time one thing I've learned by way of specifically I want to say two people that were very influential in my life which would be Erica Badu and flying Lotus is how honest the music has to be to you right like it doesn't
• 20:30 - 21:00 matter if I'm a Christian it doesn't matter if I'm you know if I'm fat it doesn't matter if I think I got small balls it doesn't matter if I like don't know how to roller skate you know it doesn't matter if I've learned kindo you know it's like that is my reality and along with that it comes the things that get Amplified by way of just nature of being that you know it's like the moment where again it's always going to go back to the black one because that's like the easy target you know it's like you know it's it's it's always been a thing but
• 21:00 - 21:30 then it's it's been nothing for me you know I didn't I didn't grow up in the Civil Rights Movement eror but apparently it still it still is happening this is still the civil rights error so it's like er where's the line here you know it's like what am I fighting for am I still like trying to prove I'm a fully I'm a full human or is it like am I immigrant am I am I immigrant you know it's like cuz I could have sworn you know it's like you know it's all laced in that in those in those areas like that but at the same time time it's like not everybody's black so
• 21:30 - 22:00 it's like that's not something somebody always is going to be able to relate to just by way of their they're not but it is one of those things to where it's still everybody's experience and if we can't relate to it if someone can't relate to it they'll relate to the idea that it's honest exactly and that's the importance of honesty in music yeah and I think it's like the the one thing another person could have for another person is empathy and just trying to understand you know because it's just what it is you know be a richer whor be it black white be it you know mid I
• 22:00 - 22:30 don't even know what the proper term for like short person be it a little person yeah being small being tall whatever you know it's like the reality is like no matter what card you've been dealt you you're still here and I think it's just for us to try to figure that out between each other you know and you know people don't get it right nobody's gotten it right so far you it's like you're still fighting over what the pyramids mean and like like what's this Stone and it's like I don't know it's like well I know what it is so keep it from you because
• 22:30 - 23:00 it's just weird we're just weird yeah and and I think that it's absurd it's most of it is literally like terrible and and sometimes absurd music can express that ABS exactly it's like you know it's just it's just you know I think the art is a reflection of life and I think it always has been I I think if you look at early I mean we're getting super nerdy I'm sorry about this but like if you look at early 20th century composers what were they reflecting they were reflecting uh industrialization they were reflecting a war were refle nuclear politics therefore of course music's going to get
• 23:00 - 23:30 more clashy of course it's going to get out of the 12one scale like of course it's going to get weird cuz things are weird exactly exactly dude your your music reflects not just what's happening but how it feels yeah yeah and I mean i' I've tried to capture that a lot of the time you know I want to talk about Kenny Loggins hey I want to talk about Kenny logins too I want to talk about Kenny loggin talk about Kenny loggin but I feel like I'm doing Kenny loggin a disservice by like being pretend jokey about it because Kenny loggin and
• 23:30 - 24:00 Michael McDonald they are kind of poster boys of the late 70s early 80s L Rock era holl notes Fleetwood Mac some Fleetwood Mac Toto my favorite Christopher Cross somebody made a joke like if I would have gotten him on on the album that it would have been like an apocalypse in the real life but whatever beautiful yeah no I mean it was totally you know in the in the in the in the positive light you know Ken Kenny loggin and Michael McDonald are on this record that's a very very different vibe than than the rest of the record it's a different vibe than maybe what people would expect from a contemporary record
• 24:00 - 24:30 what do they bring to it well one one thing I had to again like with being honest about it it's like there's a part of um part of me that is again a song writer and it's like a lot of the time people know me because of playing bass and because of the things I've been involved with when it comes to the production side like that but there's a there's a reality that exists for me that um stems from songwriting and I've I had to learn how to do that I don't I
• 24:30 - 25:00 don't know what you mean well um it's one of those things where okay a simple way to put it is like when I was younger I was very quiet I wasn't one to like always talk you know and if I ever did talk it was one of those things that was like um it came out like Snoop like a Snoopy or Woodstock it would be like you know my friends would literally mock me because of that because it would be like it was what was whatever was going on in my head was coming out if I was it it just wasn't there was no it was a seamlessness almost okay so at the same time it kind of put me in a place where
• 25:00 - 25:30 I would never look at myself as a songwriter like that but um you know with my history with music and stuff like that I would kind of I would have to try to understand things and where they came from and try to learn you know like very fast and um the best way to describe it is um I remember the moment I came across Kenny Loggins and Michael mcdonal and and realized what they meant to me as a child but I I came across it very early you know and not in the sense where it was like oh cool my parents are listening to this cool no I remember
• 25:30 - 26:00 hearing you know Warren G you know regulators and then being like man that song is funky as hell yeah and then it was just like it' be on the radio but then you'd be like and then I would know what it I already knew what sampling and you know stuff was so I didn't know where that came from but I was just kind of like I mean I'm getting tired of hearing Warren you rap over it you know and then every now and again you know you skip past the station and you hear what a Fool Believes or something and you're like well that's a lot of changes going on you're like that sounds better than what I just heard on the rap station and you're like like you know then you hear it everywhere you go you
• 26:00 - 26:30 know and then you start trying to sing like him you know you start kind you start you know like you know you kind of feel you can feel it inside it becomes internal and then from that moment then I'm like okay then I have this fullon like Steely Dan Epiphany like I I feel like if you haven't had that like explosion in your mind with that then you haven't experienced Steely Dan you know like you haven't gone the Donald Fagan way you know you you don't understand it because it's literally like it's like a ton of bricks when you realize it you know and I remember like
• 26:30 - 27:00 sitting there with Asia just on repeat just like a crackhead and then just like analyzing every last part like okay well Chuck Randy's like slapping bass in this one part Steve Gad solo that's a Steve Gad solo and it's like who's this guy it sounds like that's yeah I know and then you put the you like add you it's like 2 plus two is six you know you're just like oh this guy is doing everything this is this is the guy you know you see it you know and that's that's the Michael McDonald moment for me what are we missing like I think that I love
• 27:00 - 27:30 Christopher Cross I love that I love that Arthur's Theme Song and I love it cuz it's it's it's a beautiful sentiment too you know when you get lost between the Moon and New York City it might seem crazy but it's true like it's a beautiful sentiment but but I don't talk about it because because people laugh at it what what what are people missing what are people missing everybody the truth is like I said it's one of those things where not everybody is like a lot of the time it's like a what only way I could describe Des cribe it in in a very interesting way is like there's one time
• 27:30 - 28:00 Drake said like you know jealousy is just love and hate at the same time a lot of the time when people laugh it's because they don't know where to place it so it's like a lot of the time it's like you can't identify it but you don't know what it is anyway so all you know what to do is either make fun of it or like squash it so it has to be compartmentalized a lot of the time but as you grow I think you know especially with what with understanding you start to realize places places things actually hold you know like 15-year-old is not going to understand what it's like to be married seven times you know it's just
• 28:00 - 28:30 not going to happen you know and you know it's like you know a 40-year-old is not a 40-year-old guy is not going to understand like this Terror between why why is it so hard to make a solid decision with a younger dude you know it's like just is the way it goes but truth be told the music is is worth so much more than those moments so a lot of the time I think with people's like just again it's one of those things where they just don't know what to do with it sometimes but at the same time the truth
• 28:30 - 29:00 is told in just so it's like if you were to ask that person why they were laughing or what they were laughing at it would be like it would probably be the most intense explanation they could ever have to explain something with you know it's like this sounds like somebody that like this is like calling it yach Rock even denotes to so much more than what you it's like that's not a bad thing because I always say like if you have the money to be on a yacht that's not funny that's like real money so it's like hm like who's actually get it's like where's the and also if you hear
• 29:00 - 29:30 one of these songs in in a grocery store or something like that or if you're in the convenience store you're in the mall it's not easy to process these are sad songs no you just start yeah and you start singing them in the store like and it's like they're pouring their heart out but it's like do you look crazy cuz you're like connecting to that it's like no it's just the beauty of what it is it's amazing songw writing and that's what Kenny and Michael have been they've been these amazing songwriters you know and again you know it's like the commercialization of the stuff is like
• 29:30 - 30:00 what it is but if you have a guy there that can sit and pour his heart out on the track and it literally Translate is like Beauty that's it's amazing and it's and it's the truth is what we were talking about earlier yeah it's the truth yeah um before I let you go I wanted to talk about another 80s icon of pop music that you try to get on the record this is a Canadian show you're going to say it I'm going to say it you were trying to track down vanelli yeah man how did you do uh well you know just
• 30:00 - 30:30 I did about as good as trying to track goino vanelli down in Canon it just didn't happen what do what do you love about Gino vanelli oh my gosh man I love everything about Gino like the guy is like I mean it just it it was again there's these moments in life like I was saying musically that were just turning points and I remember Gino vanelli started me going down that path you know and again sometimes things come to you in in the ways they do you know and and
• 30:30 - 31:00 it's like everybody loves to sample and take from stuff you know but nobody ever wants to give the person credit you know because they're not keen enough to write a major sharp 11 over anything you know so they'll just take it from here you know and and because it has this feeling in that one sharp 11 that they're the major sharp 11 it's like oh it's got this little flange in the moment but you would never be able to scribe but but if you step back and look at that bigger picture and you go oh man that came from this set of progressions on this album from this year with whoa you know and
• 31:00 - 31:30 you start to see this Grandes picture and uh uh I saw that with Gino vanelli you know by I remember the Gino vanelli moment was the one intense moment for me I was like I I when was it I was uh I think I was living with my parents and um you know growing up around like you know SRA creative partners and all them like you know even mad lib and cats you know it's like there's a culture of digging for records you know I kind of grew up in that culture and your dad was a musician yeah I had records tons of Records in the house y yada and um I remember I went to
• 31:30 - 32:00 amiea I forget if it was I forget if it was when theba first opened this is amoeba in Los Angeles yes amoa in Hollywood and it was maybe in one of the earlier years when it you know like to be even even even able to say that like I feel old but I was like I remember I was there for that you know me and kamasi used to just go like his car would be the bottom it was like you open the door and it just was like CDs fall out the car you know I like this idea if you don't know by the way Amia records is is maybe the best record record store in in Los Angeles the history of record stores so you you and kamasi Washington
• 32:00 - 32:30 used to go in there oh we would just go in and it's like he you would get out of school I wouldn't be in school we would just stay there for like the whole day and you'd be finding all this stuff for like you know cheap you'd be finding all these albums that you know used people cracked and like oh like you know and I remember we um I used to have a studio with a cousin of mine and we bought we would buy records and try to listen to them find things to sample and take from and it was too specific moments I remember my brother sampling my older brother excuse me sorry I remember my
• 32:30 - 33:00 older brother sampling the Gino vanelli brotherto brother record and I remember hearing it and it sounding like just it sounded like the apocalypse it sounded like it's like what comes next is like just death you know it's like and I remember it was within the first Appaloosa on on um brother to brother and the fact that the album was even called brother to brother like it it spoke miles to me because having brothers that do music and this guy talking about his brothers and then this
• 33:00 - 33:30 music being this intense it's like I immediately fell in the Stream and I was just like that's for me and um from that moment of hearing Appaloosa I just like was I was just like I went crazy I went Gino vanelli crazy like I went got everything and I sat in my car this the moment that really hit me okay I'll tell you the moment that really hit me I was like I was looking for this feeling and the sound of like what is this and I'm looking through all the records and you know there's G from the 80s there's the living inside myself Gino you know there's a of you know what is it black
• 33:30 - 34:00 cars and there's like all those that there's and then when you go further back there's like the BG singing backgrounds you're like what I'm looking for this thing and I come across gist of the Gemini you know and I remember I it was like uh I think uh within the first two songs fly into this night and I was in my I had a Ford Explorer at the time you know and I live in I grew up in a mixed neighborhood where it was a bit rough and up it was up scale but still very Hood mhm and I remember I didn't
• 34:00 - 34:30 care if somebody ran up on me and stole my car and everything the moment I was sitting there I couldn't get out of my car until I heard the whole entire album and it was like 3 or 4 o'clock in the morning you know it's like people crackheads there's all kind of random dogs and like you know I'm sitting here and I'm like I couldn't disconnect from that moment and I remember like when I got out the car it just changed my whole entire ears I it changed my ears you know just hearing them saying F and I was just like whoa oh you know he's up there you know and I was just
• 34:30 - 35:00 like I understood it you know I was like this is the way I want to go you know I want I want to point out this is this is a big shot Canadian radio show Gino if you're listening get in touch oh he would hate me man I think you guys would do well together he would think I'm terrible like you're horrible he'd get it he'd get it yeah you know you guys both take Jazz and and and fusion and make pop records he'd he he'd get it hey well you know definitely
• 35:00 - 35:30 tried to reach out listen Before I Let You Go this has been a lot of fun talking to you man hey thank you I've really enjoyed this I think I'm less interested these days in how artists grow from when they first start playing to when they make the record that I'm talking to them about what I am interested in is how artists grow from the time they start making a record to when they end it yeah how did you grow during this the making of This Record drunk I almost went crazy that's the best way to put it what do you mean you know it's just like you
• 35:30 - 36:00 know to even call the album drunk it's just like it denotes to so much again you know where it's like you know I come from a a really hard background of hardcore punk rock you know like metal thrash metal you know you know and it's like you wouldn't be able to tell right off the bat you know because it's like oh sometimes I got some cool jewelry on or something you know it's like but no it's like I had that moment of realization this moment on the bus too where it was like you know my the bus driver is like what the hell I was like listening to like like it was either Testament or like but I
• 36:00 - 36:30 didn't cut it off it wasn't like a like a notion like I was joking I was just like you and you play bass for Suicidal Tendencies yeah for for a very long time and I mean that's part of the story in the sense of like the chaos of like I would say by the time somebody has seen me making the album drunk so to speak it's just like I don't know I know emotionally like from the Grammys to this moment like I the album didn't imagine this music existed inside of everything that was going on regardless so it was like between recording kami's album between recording Kendrick's album
• 36:30 - 37:00 between recording flying lotus's album this is like another reality you know but it was like it would I don't want to say it was like runoff but it felt like it was like it was like the Su level of what was going on up here and by the time it got to the end of it I felt like I was going crazy you know I did I'm not even going to lie it was like I'm like outputting so much to the point of where I'm just like I'm just kind of like out here I've been struck by lightning like several times and it's like you know your hair you're like all jittery and
• 37:00 - 37:30 stuff and it's like that's what it felt like and are you proud of it yeah yeah I wouldn't have it any other way you know I feel like that was the reality of the music coming through as compared to just my reality I think you know it's just I try to put it out there you know Stephen it's been a pleasure speaking with you thank you Thundercat is a multi-instrumentalist and a Grammy award-winning singer his latest album is called drunk it's available now for your responsible consumption just just listen to it at an Uber just take just take an
• 37:30 - 38:00 Uber and listen to it you don't have to drive and listen to it